Rayman Legends

[Haruka]

A cash-in title in other words.

[Keane]

Aye. I really doubt the silly nature of RO/RL would still be equally charming in a third game. I already didn't like it as much in RL. Don't get me wrong, it's original an creative, but I feel that things that have a certain kind of humour just can't stay amusing forever. When Rabbids TV Party came out I was beyond tired of jokes about toilet paper and "BWAAAH". And then to think that they still make those jokes.

[sergiomonty]

I would rather see a R1HD remake now rather than a 3rd RO-alike game.

What's the point? you have played that game like 3000 times at this point.

[Keane]

Because it's always stunning to see something old be put in new light. I have Wind Waker but you better believe Wind Waker HD is on my Christmas list.

Why did the Black Mesa fan game receive such massive attention? It's still the same game as Half-Life, but it looks so fucking amazing that the visuals manage to make it a new experience.

[OCG]

I would rather see a R1HD remake now rather than a 3rd RO-alike game.

Same. Third RO-alike game would be probably good but like other said, it would get repetitive.
What I want to see for R1HD is complete rework, adding extra cutscenes and never before seen content and perhaps tell a bit more about The Valley and The Great Protoon.

[sergiomonty]

Because it's always stunning to see something old be put in new light.

Just like Ducktales? I'll be honest... Rayman 1 was a blast, but just like Ducktales, it hasn't aged properly with modern gaming. I just imagine every website giving Rayman 1 HD scores from 5 to 7.5, just because it is too hard and unforgiving, and the bosses are unpredictable. And let's be honest. Rayman 1 had some cheap deaths too.

[OCG]

Thats why they should include different difficulty settings. Easy, Original, Normal, Hard like EWJ had.
EWJ had HD remake and if I remember correctly, all scores were good.

[sergiomonty]

Thats why they should include different difficulty settings. Easy, Original, Normal, Hard like EWJ had.
EWJ had HD remake and if I remember correctly, all scores were good.

Eh. Ducktales had those difficulties too. The problem also relies on the controls. Most of Rayman 1's controls weren't fluid enough compared to current platformers. If we exclude some sections of band land, Rayman 1 barely had momentum. Games like that nowadays get heavily criticized (games like The Cave). That's probably the reason why current 2d Rayman doesn't play like that at all.

I would rather see a R1HD remake now rather than a 3rd RO-alike game.

Same. Third RO-alike game would be probably good but like other said, it would get repetitive.
What I want to see for R1HD is complete rework, adding extra cutscenes and never before seen content and perhaps tell a bit more about The Valley and The Great Protoon.

In the other hand... Maybe I could shove in Spiraldoor's face the fact that Mr Dark is not a shapeshifter thanks to the more specific cutscenes.
HUEHUEHUEHUE.
That would be delicious.

[Cairnie]

Erm OK the challenges in the PS3 version are super glitched today. When I looked at them earlier this morning (about 9am-ish) it had 5 hours before the next one...but now on the daily challenges it's gone up to 719 hours... wtf.

The following is not my photo but it shows just that. https://twitter.com/freqrexy/status/395569146231930880

Could anyone playing other versions of the game confirm this please?

[Master]

I'll check my PS3 version and confirm.

[Rayrobi]

Not on Xbox 360, nor on PSVita is this present, on Xbox it is a Grab them Quickly challenge, and on PSVita, there is no Murfy's Dungeon.

[Master]

Yup, it's on my PS3 version as well:

[Rayrobi]

What the heck, these challenges were yesterday on Xbox.

[OCG]

In the other hand... Maybe I could shove in Spiraldoor's face the fact that Mr Dark is not a shapeshifter thanks to the more specific cutscenes.
HUEHUEHUEHUE.
That would be delicious.

Since I am also against shapeshifting theory and I wish so much I could edit shapeshift mentioning out of the wiki, I would love the cutscene with that as well. I was thinking of cutscene being played like for example Mr. Dark can't be bothered to waste time with Rayman and he has to do some "more important things", so he sends fused bosses and tells them to finish Rayman off. They start walking slowly towards Rayman while Rayman looks scared. End of cutscene and rest is same.

[Master]

Meh, I'd keep the cutscenes to a minimum, debating theories aside, I like the flow the final boss had from one phase to the next.

[Rayrobi]

I think there need to be more cutscenes, the original game has too few, it was only the intro and the ending ( same in Legends ). There need to be more, e.g. with each of the three characters Rayman encounters, or when Monsieur Dark kidnaps Betilla, ( Tarayzan, the Musician and Joe ), but as Master said:

debating theories aside

Yeah. Sure, there are many things that need to be explained, but i think not everything should be, at least in this HD remake.

[sonicbrawler182]

I think you guys are being too presumptuous about a third RO style game being repetitive.

Firstly, I think it would be fitting - if this could be a trilogy, it'd feel really complete. One thing that bugs me a little about Rayman 1-3 is that there is no coherency. They are all worthwhile games in their own rights, but they all felt like they were just trying to start something that never went anywhere.

Secondly, Legends feels like a PROPER sequel - retains what made it's predecessor great, but expands upon it. Origins didn't have musical levels. Origins didn't have Murfy. Origins didn't have online challenges. Origins didn't have Kung Foot. Origins didn't have Lucky Tickets. Origins didn't have the Creatures. Origins didn't have an open-ended progression system. And the physics of Legends are improved from Origins. And there are a lot more things to find in Legends compared to Origins. Even the "Back to Origins" levels feel like a new experience, especially with all of the added Murfy interaction on Wii U and Vita. And each world in Legends is like a darker version of a world from Origins, which is especially noticeable after playing through Back to Origins. It ties in with the "100 years have passed" story.

I think a third game to wrap it all up would be perfect. I can think of tons of things this style of Rayman has yet to offer (primary one being an open ended Metroidvania game, with a chapter select for when you want to revisit levels or do Time Trials. Also, the addition of a level creator would be ENOUGH reason to make a third RO style game, seeing as UbiArt as an engine does not appear to be going open source anytime soon, as it was supposed to).

And it's ironic how you guys say a third RO style game would "probably be repetitive with not much new", and then say the next step for the franchise should be to remake a game that you've all played to death and is already on many systems.

And based off of the discussion I've already had in the Rayman 1 topic regarding a Rayman 1 HD...you guys seem really picky about what gets added or changed. Ye basically summed it up as "HD visuals, and a difficulty select". Seriously, that sounds way more repetitive than a game that could potentially wrap up a trilogy, and would probably be a new experience.

And honestly, Rayman 1 isn't the holy grail of gaming. Origins and Legends were much better designed, and were free of hit box issues, and cheap difficulty. I'd rather another game like that than the barely changed Rayman 1 HD you guys want.

[Rayrobi]

Now, there are some points in your post that make sense, while some do not.

Firstly, I think it would be fitting - if this could be a trilogy, it'd feel really complete. One thing that bugs me a little about Rayman 1-3 is that there is no coherency. They are all worthwhile games in their own rights, but they all felt like they were just trying to start something that never went anywhere.

First, Rayman 1-3 were all good games, and there was coherency, it was not indeed a big one, but there sure was, like how Rayman 3 continued with the same characters and mostly same elements as Rayman 2.

Secondly, Legends feels like a PROPER sequel - retains what made it's predecessor great, but expands upon it.

Let's see what if we do not count "Back to Origins" in Legends:

Origins didn't have musical levels.

That's right, and is a great addition.

Origins didn't have Murfy.

True, but Legends does not have Moskito levels and Tricky Treasures. And do keep in mind, that the PSVita version of Origins had such function as Murfy, seeing you could collect bubblized items and pop bubblized enemies to get more lums, plus collect Relics ALL using the touchscreen, so this whole Murfy thing is NOT new.

Origins didn't have online challenges. Origins didn't have Kung Foot. Origins didn't have Lucky Tickets. Origins didn't have the Creatures.

Right.

Origins didn't have an open-ended progression system. And there are a lot more things to find in Legends compared to Origins. Even the "Back to Origins" levels feel like a new experience, especially with all of the added Murfy interaction on Wii U and Vita. And each world in Legends is like a darker version of a world from Origins, which is especially noticeable after playing through Back to Origins. It ties in with the "100 years have passed" story.

That is a problem that Rayman Legends does have an open ended progression system. It sure feels like you are not forced to do things in a specific order, and that's the only reason why it is better. But in Origins, it felt like it has a little bit of story, because you start from a jungle, then you have to go through all the worlds to reach Moody clouds, then you have to free 4 kings and go back to Moody Clouds to stop the Magician. Optionally you can enter the Land of the Livid Dead, but only if you have all skull teeth, otherwise the guard won't let you get in.

This is a problem in Legends, because every world is basically the same, there is nothing special, there are 6-7 levels normal levels and a musical level, and aside, you have to complete another 2 to free princesses which are NOT EVEN FOUND in the levels, and plus you can run through the invasions to free more teensies. And of course, there is a copy of the Magician in every world, first he kidnaps a female teensies, secondly he summons some monsters and you have to run away from them and then defeat the boss and the copy of the Magician, and that's it. No fucking extra or special, but at least you can't do the levels in a wrong order. ( you can decide which one is better ) And also, you basically open levels by freeing teensies, it just does not make sense for me. For example, why would you need 400 teensies to enter the Land of the Livid Dead? Why couldn't you access it before? If the Teensies actually were doing something, like gathering energy to open a passage to the Land, i would say it is OK, but this way it just does not make sense, they seem more like some dumb people who do nothing, than the original Teensies who watch over the passages of the glade.

As for the worlds, they are not so much unique anymore. The castle in world one is not unique, the idea world 2 is basically taken from a fairy tale, world 3 is like a general fiesta, world 4 is taken from stealth-action based games, and world 5 is taken from the greek mithology. They are all great, but not unique, we could see these world before and not in Rayman. In conclusion, the only unique world would be the Living Dead Party, if there were more levels than 1 that actually is from that world.

And the physics of Legends are improved from Origins.

I actually played Origins more than Legends and noticed more physics bugs in Legends, so i would not say such thing.

I think a third game to wrap it all up would be perfect. I can think of tons of things this style of Rayman has yet to offer (primary one being an open ended Metroidvania game, with a chapter select for when you want to revisit levels or do Time Trials. Also, the addition of a level creator would be ENOUGH reason to make a third RO style game, seeing as UbiArt as an engine does not appear to be going open source anytime soon, as it was supposed to).

If the next game is going to be 2D again, then it should offer many new things to not feel repetitive or boring, seeing in Legends, you have to play the same 5 challenges for a long time to reach the last rank, and with only 13 game modes in these combined, it feels damn repetitive and boring.

Basically, it has been 3 2D games from this generation and there is going to be a fourth one soon ( Fiesta Run ) and both Jungle Run and Fiesta Run didn't show or going to show anything new, even though, as you say, Rayman has many new things to offer. If there really are, why did not they show us yet?

And it's ironic how you guys say a third RO style game would be "probably be repetitive with not much new", and then say the next step for the franchise should be to remake a game that you've all played to death and is already on many systems.

All played to death? Did you think about it before you actually wrote this down?
Many players did not actually complete the game because it was so damn hard, therefore not many people played it. That's why would we want to integrate a difficulty setting, or just make the game easier, to make the game accessible to people who are not so much experienced in gaming, and would not want to spend a lifetime completing the game, and to not make them throw the controller into the TV because of the unforgiving difficulty. Also, we're not saying this should be the next step.

And based off of the discussion I've already had in the Rayman 1 topic regarding a Rayman 1 HD...you guys seem really picky about what gets added or changed. Ye basically summed it up as "HD visuals, and a difficulty select". Seriously, that sounds way more repetitive than a game that could potentially wrap up a trilogy, and would probably be a new experience.

That is far from being the idea of the final game, sure it would be repetitive if only the visuals and the difficulty would change, if there will be a remake, it would be remastered in a way that it would fit in with the current generation, yet maintain the original feeling and atmosphere the game had. But if that is the case, ask yourself this: doesn't Rayman 3 HD feel repetitive, as we have all played it to death, and no damn thing has changed, except that the visuals are actually worse and there are more bugs than in the original?

And honestly, Rayman 1 isn't the holy grail of gaming. Origins and Legends were much better designed, and were free of hit box issues, and cheap difficulty. I'd rather another game like that than the barely changed Rayman 1 HD you guys want.

We were not saying that, but some of us like it better than the newer games, and you gotta accept that. Also, Legends requires us to play a lot constantly to complete it 100%, reach the last Awesomeness and unlock the final hero, it feels like you're playing it because you are forced to, and not because you want to be entertained, that's why it feels so much boring.

[Dart]

Origins didn't have musical levels.

correct, and it's appreciated.

Origins didn't have Murfy

and I really wish he was customizable, but whatever.

And the physics of Legends are improved from Origins.

I prefer origins. the legends physics are rather floaty.

I think a third game to wrap it all up would be perfect. I can think of tons of things this style of Rayman has yet to offer (primary one being an open ended Metroidvania game, with a chapter select for when you want to revisit levels or do Time Trials. Also, the addition of a level creator would be ENOUGH reason to make a third RO style game, seeing as UbiArt as an engine does not appear to be going open source anytime soon, as it was supposed to).

so you want rayman 3-2D? the time trials weren't that good. if by open ended you mean like a Zelda world, then i'd have to disagree. I'd prefer Rayman Pomegranates to play more like R1 & origins in game play, with difficult to find baby Globoxes in the cages or adding something like the tricky treasure so the non-stop running feels legit. oh, and a intimidating villian (here's to you andre and reflux!)

[sonicbrawler182]

First, Rayman 1-3 were all good games, and there was coherency, it was not indeed a big one, but there sure was, like how Rayman 3 continued with the same characters and mostly same elements as Rayman 2.

By coherency, I mean the game mechanics. Each game is completely different. This is not inherently a bad thing, but the problem was that none of the styles of gameplay got a chance to be refined (each of them had problems). I like the idea of the RO style being given a chance to be refined/offer more.
But even in story aspects, the first three are not that coherent. Rayman 3 kept Rayman, Globox, and Murfy, but besides one or two cameos, nothing else was really kept. It's as much of a reboot as Rayman 2 was following Rayman 1.
Also, I never said Rayman 1-3 were bad games. Rayman 1 is extremely flawed, though.

True, but Legends does not have Moskito levels and Tricky Treasures. And do keep in mind, that the PSVita version of Origins had such function as Murfy, seeing you could collect bubblized items and pop bubblized enemies to get more lums, plus collect Relics ALL using the touchscreen, so this whole Murfy thing is NOT new.

Actually, the new thing that Murfy brought was asymmetrical multiplayer - something that Origins Vita DID NOT DO. Understand the point of Murfy's addition before you claim he was not a new feature.

And I know you said not to count Back To Origins, but that's damage controlling - Legends DOES have Moskito and Tricky Treasure levels. They are there, playable, on the game disc. You can't go ignoring that to "help" your point.

That is a problem that Rayman Legends does have an open ended progression system. It sure feels like you are not forced to do things in a specific order, and that's the only reason why it is better. But in Origins, it felt like it has a little bit of story, because you start from a jungle, then you have to go through all the worlds to reach Moody clouds, then you have to free 4 kings and go back to Moody Clouds to stop the Magician. Optionally you can enter the Land of the Livid Dead, but only if you have all skull teeth, otherwise the guard won't let you get in.

This is a problem in Legends, because every world is basically the same, there is nothing special, there are 6-7 levels normal levels and a musical level, and aside, you have to complete another 2 to free princesses which are NOT EVEN FOUND in the levels, and plus you can run through the invasions to free more teensies. And of course, there is a copy of the Magician in every world, first he kidnaps a female teensies, secondly he summons some monsters and you have to run away from them and then defeat the boss and the copy of the Magician, and that's it. No fucking extra or special, but at least you can't do the levels in a wrong order. ( you can decide which one is better ) And also, you basically open levels by freeing teensies, it just does not make sense for me. For example, why would you need 400 teensies to enter the Land of the Livid Dead? Why couldn't you access it before? If the Teensies actually were doing something, like gathering energy to open a passage to the Land, i would say it is OK, but this way it just does not make sense, they seem more like some dumb people who do nothing, than the original Teensies who watch over the passages of the glade.

As for the worlds, they are not so much unique anymore. The castle in world one is not unique, the idea world 2 is basically taken from a fairy tale, world 3 is like a general fiesta, world 4 is taken from stealth-action based games, and world 5 is taken from the greek mithology. They are all great, but not unique, we could see these world before and not in Rayman. In conclusion, the only unique world would be the Living Dead Party, if there were more levels than 1 that actually is from that world.

Yeah, feels like SUCH a compelling story in Origins.
Seriously, that's the definition of scraping the bottom of the barrel for a point. Origins did not feel like an epic story any more or less than Legends did. Both games are designed to be pure platforming craziness, with a lot of artistic flair in the graphics department. The story is minimal in both games. Plus, saving Nymphs and Kings is no different to saving Teensies.

Are you kidding me? The Legends worlds are all different. Structured the same, yes. But so were the Origins worlds (a few levels, one moskito level, and a tricky treasure in each world). As I said before, the Legends worlds are basically darker versions of Origins worlds (I will post screenshots that prove this sometime in the future. I can't right now, due to a Parental Control issue on my Wii U). This gives a sense of world building, that a third game could do more with.

I actually played Origins more than Legends and noticed more physics bugs in Legends, so i would not say such thing.

Until you prove that I will think Legends has more fun and versatile physics tweaks. You can't just go saying "oh yeah, I noticed more bugs in this game", and not elaborate.

If the next game is going to be 2D again, then it should offer many new things to not feel repetitive or boring, seeing in Legends, you have to play the same 5 challenges for a long time to reach the last rank, and with only 13 game modes in these combined, it feels damn repetitive and boring.

Basically, it has been 3 2D games from this generation and there is going to be a fourth one soon ( Fiesta Run ) and both Jungle Run and Fiesta Run didn't show or going to show anything new, even though, as you say, Rayman has many new things to offer. If there really are, why did not they show us yet?

The last rank is optional. The Challenge Mode was not made for completionists, it was made for competitive players.

Don't even TRY to say Jungle Run and Fiesta Run are "sequels" to Origins/Legends. They are spin-offs you play on your mobile device while you're taking a shit or waiting for a bus. They don't need to be innovative, their selling point is "HEY IT'S A MODERN RAYMAN GAME ON YOUR PHONE!". They are to the Rayman franchise what Sonic Jump and Sonic Dash are to the Sonic franchise. Expecting innovation from those is just beyond nonsensical. Especially since they are likely made on a really small budget.

All played to death? Did you think about it before you actually wrote this down?
Many players did not actually complete the game because it was so damn hard, therefore not many people played it. That's why would we want to integrate a difficulty setting, or just make the game easier, to make the game accessible to people who are not so much experienced in gaming, and would not want to spend a lifetime completing the game, and to not make them throw the controller into the TV because of the unforgiving difficulty. Also, we're not saying this should be the next step.

Yeah I did. I said "you all played Rayman 1 to death", referring specifically to the people saying there should be a Rayman 1 HD as opposed to a new UbiArt game, within this topic. Because the SPECIFIC people I was referring to HAVE played the game to death. Some have even done walkthroughs on YouTube.

Actually, Rayman 1 sold really well, so lots of people have played it.
Well, people are certainly saying it would be a better step than a new 2D game like Legends. Objectively, a follow-up to Legends would be a better decision for Ubi. Worldwide, and across all platforms, the game has sold decently. Not only that, but it's a formula that people are enjoying, and the masses would like more of it (certainly seems to be the case for Wii U players, I see a lot of Miiverse posts that say they want another game like Legends).

And if you want to fix Rayman 1's cheap and unfair difficulty for inexperienced gamers, you'd actually have to take a lot of cues from Origins/Legends anyway (infinite lives, clear hit boxes, having all powers from the beginning like in Legends, better sense of momentum). But when I made those VERY suggestions on this VERY forum, with the VERY people asking for Rayman 1 HD in this topic, I was told "that would be tampering too much with the original game". Knowing how people are with classic games, Ubisoft would never be able to please people with a Rayman 1 HD remaster. They could easily please many with a new RO style game, though.

That is far from being the idea of the final game, sure it would be repetitive if only the visuals and the difficulty would change, if there will be a remake, it would be remastered in a way that it would fit in with the current generation, yet maintain the original feeling and atmosphere the game had. But if that is the case, ask yourself this: doesn't Rayman 3 HD feel repetitive, as we have all played it to death, and no damn thing has changed, except that the visuals are actually worse and there are more bugs than in the original?

Again, Ubisoft would not be able to please people with that kind of tall order for a remake.
HD remasters are given to games that are objectively really good, because all that needs to be improved are the graphics. Rayman 1 would require much more than that.
My only experience with Rayman 3 is with the HD remaster. I've never played the original (and see no need to). I didn't encounter any glitches. And the original game must of been quite solid, because so was the HD remaster. That backs up my previous point - HD remasters are for games that don't need a huge load of changes.

We were not saying that, but some of us like it better than the newer games, and you gotta accept that. Also, Legends requires us to play a lot constantly to complete it 100%, reach the last Awesomeness and unlock the final hero, it feels like you're playing it because you are forced to, and not because you want to be entertained, that's why it feels so much boring.

I accept that people like Rayman 1 more than Origins/Legends just fine, but the idea that a HD remake of Rayman 1 would be better for the franchise than a finale game for the RO style is objectively wrong, and I've already proven that. As I initially said, you guys are just assuming that a Legends sequel would add nothing new, even though Legends added tons that Origins didn't have.

And unlocking the final hero in Legends is optional. Rayomz is a reward for competitive players, not completionists. You are not forced at all. 100%ing Legends means getting all of the Teensies and Lum Cups. Rayomz and the 11th Level of Awesomeness is only a grind for those who aren't as good at the game. I'm very good at the game, and got both within a reasonable amount of time (I achieved the 11th Level of Awesomeness when I beat my last singleplayer level, "The Mama of All Nightmares". I got Rayomz not too long after getting all of the Teensies. About a week later, I believe it was. This was because I cared about the Challenges because they were a fun, competitive game, therefore, I happily played them to improve at the game. If you have a greedy mindset of "I MUST HAVE EVERY SKIN EVEN THOUGH I WON'T PLAY THE GAME AFTER I GET THE FINAL ONE", that's your fault, not the developers).