Rayman 3D

[Adsolution]

>Bad stuff about Revolution<

That, good sir, is utter b*****t.

If you have literally nothing but unsubstantiated insults to contribute, I suggest that you keep your small, pre-pubescent hands off our Rayman 3D thread.

Spiral, you're non-sensically bashing Recolution with terrible, biased, snooty reasons that have nothing to do with what's actually in front of you. You sound like the Westbro Baptist Church on non-conformity. For one, if you know all the versions so well, you'd easily be able to tell that that is the Dreamcast version, not the N64 version. It's easy to tell because in the Dreamcast version, the lighting is a little different than all the others, and his fingers are 3D. In the N64 version they're one flat model with a texture to make it look like fingers. Also if you're talking about graphical superiority, Revolution is factually miles better. How? It's a generation ahead, and everything in the Dreamcast version is lower quality in terms of polygons and detail. Just because you don't care about dynamic shadows or 3D replacements doesn't mean they now magically don't have anything to do with the graphics quality, even though poly count and shading quality are the main factors of graphics quality. You also said that you "liked the cell-shading on the original mushrooms." Do you even know what cell-shading means? Obviously not. The original mushrooms were 2D sprites that could only rotate along the Z axis to meet you camera's orientation. They had no shading. 2D spites actually never had he ability to be shaded until DirectX10 came along where individual per-node shaders were introduced. That let individual objects have non-geometric shaders applied to them. The best example is motion blur. Before DX10, motion blur was a screen-space effect, often it was accomplished by interlacing frames. Now as DX10 came along, it had enough ability to produce shaders that weren't just effects assigned to flat 3D polygons, but shaders that handle per-node effects that didn't take up a 3D space that didn't use cheap unrealistic effects such as interlacing frames. Now what were once screen space effects can be applied to any single node in the 3D space: if let's say, three objects are falling in different directions on the screen, only those objects get blurred, while the rest of the viewport remains unaffected.

I work with in-depth 3D work constantly. Your argumets on graphical superiority are so basic and uneducated that I'm rolling my eyes twice around.

Also insulting IHeckler9 because of his age and supposed maturity is, in fact, very, very immature of you. That's what bullies do; they make fun of other people for no reason other than to make themselves feel more important and vital than them. He has every right to disagree with you, whether he gives his reasons or not. At least he isn't blurting out religiously biased words that actually don't make up anything for a reasonable response.

Everything you've said about how bad Revolution is gameplay wise sounds like complete opinions that most people don't share spat out as facts. Everythig you mentioned I completely disagree with, right down to the intentions for the reasons you gave. All the reasons you gave were why I like Revolution, but replace all the negative words like "stupid" with words like "great." I'm sorry I prefer games to be in-depth with sidequests rather than shallow and liniar. Yea, I did just say shallow. Rayman 2 is a very shallow game, but that doesn't mean it isn't one of greatest games of all time.

I do agree with Drolpiraat pretty much. The Hall of Doors was an extremely magical area that defined that atmosphere. I think if they used the Hall of Doors design and atmosphere but made it like the Minisaurus plains (as in a free-roaming Hall of Doors), it would be perfect.

[spiraldoor]

Spiral, you're non-sensically bashing Recolution with terrible, biased, snooty reasons that have nothing to do with what's actually in front of you. You sound like the Westbro Baptist Church on non-conformity.

No, I am not ‘non-sensically bashing’ Revolution. I am attempting to explain clearly and in great detail exactly why I dislike it. My reasons are not ‘terrible’. That’s silly. There is nothing ‘terrible’ about anything I have said. My reasons are obviously ‘biased’ in favour of my own argument in precisely the same way that your reasons are ‘biased’ in favour of your own. ‘Snooty’? I’m not sure what you are referring to, but I don’t see how any of my statements are in any way inappropriate. You claim that my reasons for disliking Revolution ‘have nothing to do with what’s actually in front of me’? What nonsense. Every single reason I gave is directly related to the game; what more do you want?

You then compare me to the Westboro Baptist Church, which is simply insulting and makes no sense. Please explain exactly how my arguments resemble theirs if you wish for me to take this comparison seriously, as I can see no sense in it.

For one, if you know all the versions so well, you'd easily be able to tell that that is the Dreamcast version, not the N64 version. It's easy to tell because in the Dreamcast version, the lighting is a little different than all the others, and his fingers are 3D. In the N64 version they're one flat model with a texture to make it look like fingers.

I know all the versions very well, but the screenshots you posted looked as if they had been taken from a television with a digital camera. I can’t see anything version-specific about most of them, and they are far too blurry and compressed to be of any worth in an in-depth discussion on the different versions of the game. Moreover I have not played Revolution in a couple of years due to my dislike of it, meaning that I am less likely to spot its subtle differences that I would otherwise have been. I am more concerned with the gameplay and the games’ story and universe than I am with miniscule graphical alterations.

Also if you're talking about graphical superiority, Revolution is factually miles better. How? It's a generation ahead, and everything in the Dreamcast version is lower quality in terms of polygons and detail. Just because you don't care about dynamic shadows or 3D replacements doesn't mean they now magically don't have anything to do with the graphics quality, even though poly count and shading quality are the main factors of graphics quality. You also said that you "liked the cell-shading on the original mushrooms." Do you even know what cell-shading means? Obviously not. The original mushrooms were 2D sprites that could only rotate along the Z axis to meet you camera's orientation. They had no shading. 2D spites actually never had he ability to be shaded until DirectX10 came along where individual per-node shaders were introduced. That let individual objects have non-geometric shaders applied to them. The best example is motion blur. Before DX10, motion blur was a screen-space effect, often it was accomplished by interlacing frames. Now as DX10 came along, it had enough ability to produce shaders that weren't just effects assigned to flat 3D polygons, but shaders that handle per-node effects that didn't take up a 3D space that didn't use cheap unrealistic effects such as interlacing frames. Now what were once screen space effects can be applied to any single node in the 3D space: if let's say, three objects are falling in different directions on the screen, only those objects get blurred, while the rest of the viewport remains unaffected.

I work with in-depth 3D work constantly. Your argumets on graphical superiority are so basic and uneducated that I'm rolling my eyes twice around.

Jesus Christ, absolutely none of this has anything whatsoever to do with Rayman Revolution. I mistakenly used one piece of graphical terminology where I should have used another, and you use it as an excuse to give me a fucking essay about DirectX, interspersed with plenty of condescending comments informing us of how knowledgeable you are about 3D graphics and how my ‘uneducated’ statements make you ‘roll your eyes’. Why are you acting like such an arrogant prick today?

Also insulting IHeckler9 because of his age and supposed maturity is, in fact, very, very immature of you. That's what bullies do; they make fun of other people for no reason other than to make themselves feel more important and vital than them. He has every right to disagree with you, whether he gives his reasons or not. At least he isn't blurting out religiously biased words that actually don't make up anything for a reasonable response.

I am not being ‘very, very immature’ – there you go with your condescending nonsense again. I did not ‘make fun of him to make myself feel important and vital’ – where the hell did you get that from? He didn’t just ‘disagree with me without giving reasons’ – he specifically called my arguments ‘bullshit’ and failed to provide any logical basis whatsoever to support his deliberately inflammatory point of view. He insulted me without provocation and I responded with another. Perhaps you don’t read many of his posts, but iHeckler enjoys annoying me as much as possible; dropping into the thread to mention that my well-thought-out arguments are ‘bullshit’ is just the latest example of this. I strongly suspect that you would not be defending him and attempting to paint me as a ‘bully’ and him as a victim if not for the fact that he supports your side of the argument. And what’s this ‘religiously biased words’ nonsense? Are you still trying to compare me to Christian fundamentalists without providing any supporting logical reasons? Please stop. You are being ridiculous, and the fact that the final sentence of your above paragraph is a grammatically incomprehensible mess isn’t helping matters.

Everything you've said about how bad Revolution is gameplay wise sounds like complete opinions that most people don't share spat out as facts. Everythig you mentioned I completely disagree with, right down to the intentions for the reasons you gave. All the reasons you gave were why I like Revolution, but replace all the negative words like "stupid" with words like "great." I'm sorry I prefer games to be in-depth with sidequests rather than shallow and liniar. Yea, I did just say shallow. Rayman 2 is a very shallow game, but that doesn't mean it isn't one of greatest games of all time.

The fact that everything I have said is my ‘opinion’ is implicit in my posts. What do you want me to do, add the acronym ‘IMHO’ to the end of each and every sentence? That’s daft. Everything ever said by everyone is subjective, so why do you get annoyed when they do not explicity remind you? Not to mention the fact that this particular branch of your argument (‘That’s just your opinion and is therefore not fact’) could very easily be turned against you (except I am not that desperate). You claim that most people don’t share my views. Citation needed. I was under the impression that the Dreamcast version received better reviews than Revolution, which would make you rather incorrect here. You top off this nonsense with a silly claim that Revolution is ‘in-depth with sidequests’ and the Dreamcast version is ‘shallow and linear’; poor argument. The sidequests created by the Revolution team were crap compared to the levels created by Michel Ancel and his team. The game was better the way it was (zomg this iz ownley mie oppinyonz lolz).

I do agree with Drolpiraat pretty much. The Hall of Doors was an extremely magical area that defined that atmosphere. I think if they used the Hall of Doors design and atmosphere but made it like the Minisaurus plains (as in a free-roaming Hall of Doors), it would be perfect.

It is difficult to say if that would actually work well or not. The Hall of Doors is perfectly good as it is, and I am not sure if giving Rayman the ability to wander about when there’s nothing else there would benefit the game in any way. It would be a bit like free-walking Rayman around the Rayman 1 map – sort of pointless. The ability to rotate the camera within the Hall of Doors would be a welcome addition, however.

[Haruka]

Here we go again.

I always felt scaled between which version is the best one: the Dreamcast or the Playstation 2.

If people asked me to pick up the two best Rayman 2 versions I would not hesitate in naming the versions above.

Now if they asked me just one, it is very complicated for me to name.

Let's see:

The Dreamcast version is without doubts the best classical R2 ever made. I've grown up with the PC version, and when I've tried the Dreamcast version in a real console, I had to pick up my jaw from the floor due to these details:

- The graphics looked quite good for its time. Even better than the PC. When the Dreamcast was released, it was around 2 more generations further than the Playstation 1 and the Nintendo 64. I've also noticed that the game runs smoothly in 60 FPS without any "hiccup" in the middle. There was a good threatment in this version.

- The game title appears before going to the game menu, and the text is rendered in 3D. Quite good.

- The pause screen is beautiful with the kaleidoscope looping effect with the Super Yellow Lum.

- The buttons response time in the Dreamcast controller was excellent. Rayman answered very smoothly with a lot of precision and in real-time. Even more than the PC version.

- I also loved the VMU black and white screens, especially the normal looping animation of Rayman running after a Popolopoï.

- There were graphical details added in the game (Example: More bats, more piranhas, more Popolopoï , etc.)

- There are in-game details added in the game, like Henchmen 800 that can shoot Helicopter Pirate Bombs and most important of all: the Globox Village accessible in the Woods of Light, with the Disc cinematic, the 3 mini-games unlocked during gameplay by catching the crystals (that were well more hidden as long as we proceeded in the gameplay) and the extra 3 mini-games downloadable in the internet with Dreamcast's modem.

- I love the Isle of Doors, despite of being familiarized with the Hall of Doors from the PC version, which I also like a lot.

Now, about Rayman Revolution is a remake of R2 done exclusively for Playstation 2, with major changes in several levels. These are my pros:

- The game remodeled 2D models to 3D, which I quite appreciate that. In landscapes and architectural elements, it makes the levels visually less empty than the flatted look of 2D, despite of the original 2D elements being quite well executed and pretty to look at. A perticular detail I point positively is remodeled design of Globox and the Baby Globox's eyes. It made them look quite better than before.

- Characters and objects were generally remodeled in order to look more rounder and better. Indeed the models are noticibly worked. Especially Rayman. I love Rayman's model in Rayman Revolution. Shadows are also more realistic, since it isn't a simple circle projected into the floor. But I also didn't dislike the circular shadow, due to its simplicity (I say honestly that it isn't ugly).

- There are extra musics in the game, also done by Éric Chevalier. They are well done.

- I quite like the increased Artificial Inteligence done into the pirate Henchmen 800, caracterized by 5 different levels (Distinguishable by the clothes colour they wear, attacks and health). They also try to avoid Rayman's magical spheres if thrown by far. This makes the game more challenging.

- There are level remodelations done with the addition of flora, fauna and architectural elements. It incentives the level exploration, it gives more life, it is more eye-catching and it shows more what the Glade of Dreams has got. It also attempted to rise up the difficulty level of the game that gets progressively harder and to improve the gameplay quality.

- The Magic Well system incentives players to collect all the Yellow Lums in the game (Which wasn't obligatory in the classical Rayman 2 in order to complete the game except of course to open the doors in the Chamber of the Teensies).

- There are new elements/characters added into the game that didn't exist in the classical versions (Example: The Zombie Henchmen, the 4th Polokus Mask Guardian: Grolem 13, the Rain Mask, etc.). I love the extra animation of Rayman doing the grimace.

- There is voice casting in the Playstation 2 version, which is more carefuly done than in the Playstation 1 version. I quite like the English voice cast, but the French/Original voice cast is, by far, superior to the English version. I can't give my opinion to the German one since I didn't test, but I also didn't test the Raymanian one that has got small differences according to what I've been listening (which is offered here as an optional voice cast). By reminding the voice casts of the Playstation 1 version, this is my rating level of the 5 voice casts from the best one to the worst one (being the last ones a real shame): French>English>German>Spanish>Italian.

- There are new levels added. This increases longevity and incentives the exploration.

* I think I'm not forgetting anything else.*

These are the things I like in the Playstation 2 version. However, there are cons that I also point negatively:

- The graphics don't run constantly in 60 FPS, which makes the gameplay feel sometimes a bit slowish.

- The loading screens could have been much better. They could have putted pictures, or the type of level parts transition animation of the Dreamcast version or even a whole new kind of loading screen with picture and animation. This also applicates to the Rayman Revolution title screen and the pause screen.

- The voices in Rayman Revolution look low when both music and voice/sound effects are in the maximum valours. To a person listen really well the character dialogues and the sound effects, a person must to low down the music.

- The new musics despite of good, they look a bit out of Rayman 2 theme, maybe it's a feeling of mine.

- The controls aren't as smooth and fast as in the Dreamcast version, but they aren't bad here.

- The system used to get more powers could have been better planned. Instead of the Magic Well, I think it could exist more challenges/missions to Rayman get the respective powers as a reward. At least a player is forced to collect all the Yellow Lums in order to unlock everything included the mini-games.

- I don't find reasons for Ubisoft have taken out the Disc cinematic in this version. Its abcense makes the game look a bit random maybe? Even with the explanation of the disk written in text?

- The inexistence of the Isle of Doors forces a player to look for the levels and explore the areas. The structure is confusing, I confess. It is what I felt in the first times I've played Rayman Revolution. By finishing the game at least 2 times, it made me already locate myself in the hub system done here. It makes the game last longer to complete and not everyone likes this kind of system. People that don't like the hub system in platform games feel dismotivated and bored.

- There are some animations in Rayman Revolution that look too much artificial. I can remember to see Henchmen shooting normal plasma cannons without rising up the cannon as they usually did in the classical versions. What the hell?

- I feel disappointed of the game not featuring a 4th Sanctuary and a better battling system of Grolem 13. A person just finishes the normal level of the Iron Mountains and suddenly finds random icy platforms in the air "easily" acessible. It is suppoused (according to Ly) to the Masks being hidden in secret and mysterious places well guarded by guardians, is that right Ubisoft?.... Ubisoft?.... Ubisoft?!

*I think I also didn't forget anything else*

My conclusion: Since I find more defects in Rayman Revolution than in Dreamcast's Rayman 2: The Great Escape (Which are pratically null), I point the Dreamcast version as being the best of all. However, I also think it depends of the players' preferences: if a player likes to play a simple game in a straight-forward way I would recommend him/her Dreamcast's Rayman 2: The Great Escape. If a player valourizes the longevity and the level exploration in hubs I would recommend him/her Rayman Revolution.

*Phew* And this is my opinion. Now I'm going to sleep, I'm tired.

[Sabertooth]

But why do you even care how the press release is worded? I don’t understand why it matters so much to you that an acknowledgement is made that the game is a port. Anyone who wants more information on Rayman 3D can easily find it, so what’s the problem? Besides, the press release specifically mentions that the game is based on the Dreamcast version of Rayman 2.

Look, it's just one of those things that bugs me, like when someone leaves my bathroom light on or opens doors for no reason. I even admit that it's a nitpicky detail. Don't think too much about it.

[Adsolution]

Spiral, you analyze what people say always in the wrong way. My simple point about the graphics was that you blatantly pretty much said that the graphics are worse and gave completely invalid reasons why, such as the cell-shaded 2D mushrooms point which has everything wrong with it. By saying that, you proved that you don't really know what you're talking about. You also said "why should I care about dynamic shadows and polycount?" when we're talking about graphics. Also when I give an example, you somehow think that it's not an example and I'm being picky. My reference to 3D mushrooms was an example, and your reply was "ZOMFG MUSCHREWMNS, WHO CARES ABOUT MUSHROOMS" or something like that. Yes, you even used the caps.

And about iHeckler9, sure maybe he didn't really have any logical reasoning in his post, but you still somehow stooped to the low level of saying "get your pre-pubescent hands away from our Rayman 3D thread." I don't know if you even slightly realize this, but insulting people for something they don't have control over is ten times worse than what he did and is probably the most hurtful thing you can do (and it very largely ranges depending on the situation). It's the same thing as if you were to walk up to and old person and call them a boring, wasteful old geezer. Or if you were to walk up face-to-face with a rape victim and say "you were asking for it." Of course like I said it ranges in hurtfulness depending on the circumstances, but the principle is certainly no different.

Also excuse my grammatical errors or typos I sometimes have right now, I'm trying to type from my iPod.

[Cairnie]

Revolution might have had the nice add-ons and that but it was choppy as shit because it was a lazy launch game.

Enough with the unnecessary drama surrounding this if you please.

[spiraldoor]

Spiral, you analyze what people say always in the wrong way. My simple point about the graphics was that you blatantly pretty much said that the graphics are worse and gave completely invalid reasons why, such as the cell-shaded 2D mushrooms point which has everything wrong with it. By saying that, you proved that you don't really know what you're talking about. You also said "why should I care about dynamic shadows and polycount?" when we're talking about graphics. Also when I give an example, you somehow think that it's not an example and I'm being picky. My reference to 3D mushrooms was an example, and your reply was "ZOMFG MUSCHREWMNS, WHO CARES ABOUT MUSHROOMS" or something like that. Yes, you even used the caps.

What does it matter if I didn’t have the correct terminology to describe the goddamn mushrooms? I recognised that they were 2D objects in a 3D space, like most of the cell-shaded objects I have seen, and unsure of what the exact term was I described them as having a ‘cell-shaded look’ upon which Revolution’s chunky 3D models were not an improvement. This does not give you an excuse to produce a 352-word lecture about DirectX shaders. I don’t the great games development knowledge that you unsubtly took the opportunity to show off in your previous post – I need only reasonably good eyesight to tell that, in spite of any improvements made by the Revolution team, the Dreamcast version is a much better-looking game. I ask you again: have you actually played it? And no, I did not say that ‘dynamic shadows and polycount’ do not matter; I pointed out – and yes, riduculed – the insignificance of the specific examples of dynamic shadowing and improved polycount which you championed in the face of Revolution’s far greater flaws. If you find that my comparative lack of knowledge regarding the subtleties of game development somehow objectively harms my argument, then I recommend that you should read Phoenixan’s far more informed posts on the matter.

And about iHeckler9, sure maybe he didn't really have any logical reasoning in his post, but you still somehow stooped to the low level of saying "get your pre-pubescent hands away from our Rayman 3D thread." I don't know if you even slightly realize this, but insulting people for something they don't have control over is ten times worse than what he did and is probably the most hurtful thing you can do (and it very largely ranges depending on the situation). It's the same thing as if you were to walk up to and old person and call them a boring, wasteful old geezer. Or if you were to walk up face-to-face with a rape victim and say "you were asking for it." Of course like I said it ranges in hurtfulness depending on the circumstances, but the principle is certainly no different.

Do you think I was born yesterday? You speak as if addressing someone with absolutely no life experience. You think that I have never been bullied because of something over which I have no control? Pointing out that someone is pre-pubescent is only mildly offensive. It happens countless times to most people during their childhood, including me and most likely you too, so there’s no use whining about it. He was asking for it by bluntly insulting my carefully constructed argument – a far more offensive act than my response. The examples you provide of the verbal abuse of the elderly and rape victims are absolutely, stunningly ridiculous. I still have no idea what the hell you were thinking when you compared me to the Westboro Baptist Church ‘on non-conformity’ – what is that, anyway? A religious term?

Also excuse my grammatical errors or typos I sometimes have right now, I'm trying to type from my iPod.

It does not matter if you have an excuse for grammatical errors. All that matters is that I can actually understand what you are trying to say, which is not always the case.

[Eshap]

Enough with the unnecessary drama surrounding this if you please.

I gotta agree with Stacey here; I think 2 pages of this baloney pushing it. I don't want to sound like a backseat moderator as I'm aware the community doesn't appreciate it, but aren't we getting off track now of the thread topic?

Unless there's nothing to say about it right now. I got nothin'.

[iHeckler9]

He was asking for it by bluntly insulting my carefully constructed argument – a far more offensive act than my response.

Stop bashing Revolution and I might show some respect.

And getting into fights about mushrooms from video games?

[spiraldoor]

He was asking for it by bluntly insulting my carefully constructed argument – a far more offensive act than my response.

Stop bashing Revolution and I might show some respect.

I don’t value your respect. What I want is for you to stop intentionally pestering me if you are not even able to articulate constructive ideas. I was not ‘bashing’ Revolution – I was explaining why I dislike it with great clarity and detail. You have said nothing intelligent or worthwhile so far.

And getting into fights about mushrooms from video games?

The graphics. We were talking about the graphics. Good lord you are a fool. I don’t know if you think that you are being funny or if you are simply attempting to piss me off; either way, please leave and come back when you actually have something to say.

[Sabertooth]

I like how the press release calls Rayman 2 the best game in the "trilogy". Even Ubisoft likes the idea of calling it that.

[iHeckler9]

He was asking for it by bluntly insulting my carefully constructed argument – a far more offensive act than my response.

Stop bashing Revolution and I might show some respect.

I don’t value your respect. What I want is for you to stop intentionally pestering me if you are not even able to articulate constructive ideas. I was not ‘bashing’ Revolution – I was explaining why I dislike it with great clarity and detail. You have said nothing intelligent or worthwhile so far.

And getting into fights about mushrooms from video games?

The graphics. We were talking about the graphics. Good lord you are a fool. I don’t know if you think that you are being funny or if you are simply attempting to piss me off; either way, please leave and come back when you actually have something to say.

What was that Rayfan9876 said about bullying?

[spiraldoor]

I like how the press release calls Rayman 2 the best game in the "trilogy". Even Ubisoft likes the idea of calling it that.

Is it reading too deeply into the press release to speculate that this was some sort of reference to the actual upcoming ‘Rayman Trilogy’ for the PS3?

What was that Rayfan9876 said about bullying?

I am not ‘bullying’ you. I am letting you know that I have a serious problem with your posting habits, specifically your attitude towards me.

[iHeckler9]

Sabertooth perfect ninja'd me.

[Adsolution]

Spiral, you obviously say you weren't "bullying," yet you factually were. Factually. Sure maybe you don't like being called that, but the truth is you were doing it and you can possibly deny that fact. Insulting someone like that is in no way not a bullish comment. You can't just say somethinlike that and say it doesn't count because you didn't intend it do be that way. Well what else did you intend it to mean, and what was the purpose of it? The reason I'm focusing on his so much is because inabaolutely can't stand it when people do stuff like this. Me comparing you using this examples I said are not ridiculous in any way, any how. They are 100% valid comparisons that have equal principle. There's absolutely nothing about insulting someone's age/maturity that's any more moral than insulting a victim, or anyone else that that is beig insulted for something they can't control. You could have said something that didn't involve a bully statement. "But I'm not a bully." Well your direct insult states otherwise.

And the reason probably why multiple people have said you're bashing Revolution is because you state everything as fact. Yet you say it's just an opinion? It absolutely does not sound like that's what you mean. Even after I pointed it out, you always state "this is[/] the truth, this is how it is, these are/I] the facts. How can the way you say things possibly be interpreted as an opinion? What you actually mean deep down doesn't count. It's not like we're somehow supposed to see that.

Actually, I don't know if you ever said it was your opinion that Revolution has worse graphics or if you actually were stating it as fact. I chose to think you meant it as opinion, but if you didn't and you actually spoke of them as fact, then gtfo, you have every right to have your words called bullshit. But if it was opinion, you have to actually try way way way harder to make it remotely sound close to an opinion.

Yes, I confess I went a little far with describing shaders for DX10, but it's just like a guy I had PMing me on YouTube saying that "GPUs take care of rendering everything such as textures," when in fact the GPU takes care of rendering everything except textures. Sorry, but the most incorrect possible answer as a single or double example doesn't look good at all.

Anyway, I think a cross between Revolution with all it's features and graphics, combined with the Hall of Doors would be the perfect port. But if there are improved graphics, I'd like to see some higher poly models as well. High quality lighting should go hand-and-hand with polycount, because the more realistic the shading/lighting is, the more prominent the low-quality models are. Please use the Revolution models.

[spiraldoor]

Spiral, you obviously say you weren't "bullying," yet you factually were. Factually. Sure maybe you don't like being called that, but the truth is you were doing it and you can possibly deny that fact. Insulting someone like that is in no way not a bullish comment. You can't just say somethinlike that and say it doesn't count because you didn't intend it do be that way. Well what else did you intend it to mean, and what was the purpose of it? The reason I'm focusing on his so much is because inabaolutely can't stand it when people do stuff like this. Me comparing you using this examples I said are not ridiculous in any way, any how. They are 100% valid comparisons that have equal principle. There's absolutely nothing about insulting someone's age/maturity that's any more moral than insulting a victim, or anyone else that that is beig insulted for something they can't control. You could have said something that didn't involve a bully statement. "But I'm not a bully." Well your direct insult states otherwise.

Saying that someone is ‘pre-pubescent’ is nothing like insulting a rape victim, and that’s a stupid comparison to make. He deliberately provoked me by insulting my intelligence; why don’t you spend a few pages whining at him too? And look, here is a post from last month in which Stacey points out the age of a member who was behaving immaturely, which is exactly what I did; why aren’t you ranting about that too? It’s ridiculous that you’re seriously making a multi-post argument out of my comment and how horribly evil and callous you think it is. Members right here have called me things a thousand times worse and I never moped about it.

And the reason probably why multiple people have said you're bashing Revolution is because you state everything as fact. Yet you say it's just an opinion? It absolutely does not sound like that's what you mean. Even after I pointed it out, you always state "this is[/] the truth, this is how it is, these are/I] the facts. How can the way you say things possibly be interpreted as an opinion? What you actually mean deep down doesn't count. It's not like we're somehow supposed to see that.

I don’t think you understand how dialogue works: if someone says something, then it is automatically subjective. I’m not going to stick ‘IMHO’ at the end of every goddamn sentence I type, which is essentially what you are asking my to do. If I say something is so, then that clearly means that I think it is so. If I say ‘Revolution is a bad game’, then that means that I consider Revolution to be a bad game. Is this really too hard for you? And who are these ‘multiple people’ who have claimed that I am ‘bashing’ Revolution? I only recall one.

Actually, I don't know if you ever said it was your opinion that Revolution has worse graphics or if you actually were stating it as fact. I chose to think you meant it as opinion, but if you didn't and you actually spoke of them as fact, then gtfo, you have every right to have your words called bullshit. But if it was opinion, you have to actually try way way way harder to make it remotely sound close to an opinion.

The Dreamcast version of Rayman 2 is a far better-looking game than Revolution. Does it still count as an ‘opinion’ when I have the proof in front of my eyes and I am absolutely one hundred per cent certain that I am correct? Anyone can verify that the Dreamcast version looks better simply by playing and comparing the two. (And I ask you for the third time: have you actually played it?) No, he has no right to call my entire multi-paragraph argument ‘bullshit’ before storming out of the thread. If he wants to be taken seriously he will have to counter my points with logical arguments of his own – something of which he is evidently incapable.

[Adsolution]

Saying that someone is ‘pre-pubescent’ is nothing like insulting a rape victim, and that’s a stupid comparison to make. He deliberately provoked me by insulting my intelligence; why don’t you spend a few pages whining at him too? And look, here is a post from last month in which Stacey points out the age of a member who was behaving immaturely, which is exactly what I did; why aren’t you ranting about that too? It’s ridiculous that you’re seriously making a multi-post argument out of my comment and how horribly evil and callous you think it is. Members right here have called me things a thousand times worse and I never moped about it.

You are honestly the most insensitive person I have ever met. He didn't insult your intellegence, he said that what you said is complete crap, probably because of the strange your-opinion-is-the-truth way you talk about things. You even just proved at the bottom of your most recent post that everyone is entitled to your opinion by literally saying that you know that you are one-hundred percent correct that the Dreamcast version is better in every way. WTF? To continue on that, read the bottom of my post.

You also miss over every single important thing on the planet that doesn't revolve around logic. Calling him pre-pubescent in the form of being informative is completely harmless, but in the form of an attack/insult, it's the worst kind of attack/insult you can commit. You seem to be unable to distinguish between what you say, what you mean, and what it perceived.

"He deliberately provoked me:"
OH THAT'S NICE, SIR. He provoked me with an inoffensive to-be-expected response, so I have the right to act like a complete insensitive jackass. Cool story. The appearance of bashing something will easily provoke that kind of response. INTERESTINGLY ENOUGH, that kind of response does not harm or talk about you as a person, it technically just says that what you are saying is being completely disagreed with. Your response attacked him as a person, which is just never okay. You say I've never mentioned this to Stacey? Well actually I have.

"Saying that someone is ‘pre-pubescent’ is nothing like insulting a rape victim:"
It's exactly IN PRINCIPLE like insulting a rape victim.

I don’t think you understand how dialogue works: if someone says something, then it is automatically subjective. I’m not going to stick ‘IMHO’ at the end of every goddamn sentence I type, which is essentially what you are asking my to do. If I say something is so, then that clearly means that I think it is so. If I say ‘Revolution is a bad game’, then that means that I consider Revolution to be a bad game. Is this really too hard for you? And who are these ‘multiple people’ who have claimed that I am ‘bashing’ Revolution? I only recall one.

I don't think you understand how dialogue works: if someone says something, whether the person appears to be trying to be subjective or not completely depends on how the person says what he/she is trying to say. Unfortunately, if you read over what you type, you will see that everything you say sounds entirely like you're spreading your opinion as hard fact... until we found out that IS what you're doing. Refer to the last part of your most recent post.

Being subjective isn't an on and off switch where not being subjective means to not put anything saying it's your opinion, and being subjective means putting IMHO at the end of every sentence. It all matters in the way you type. A simple "this is my opinion..." or "this is what I think..." or "I think that..." at the beginning of your post isn't hard, and it clears the path for you to type how ever you want and not sound like you're trying to spread your opinion as fact. Unfortunately you're so strictly logic-based that I can't see how you could possibly understand the difference between perception and intention.

The Dreamcast version of Rayman 2 is a far better-looking game than Revolution. Does it still count as an ‘opinion’ when I have the proof in front of my eyes and I am absolutely one hundred per cent certain that I am correct? Anyone can verify that the Dreamcast version looks better simply by playing and comparing the two. (And I ask you for the third time: have you actually played it?) No, he has no right to call my entire multi-paragraph argument ‘bullshit’ before storming out of the thread. If he wants to be taken seriously he will have to counter my points with logical arguments of his own – something of which he is evidently incapable.

Spiraldoor you can't say that, because it's entirely 100% wrong. The Dreamcast version literally can't be factually better looking than Revolution. Like I said before, the 3D model replacements (okay fine, you don't like those), the much higher-poly characters which can't possibly look worse, dynamic shadows, plus many, many other things. You have every right to say you like the Dreamcast's lighting, or even the entire graphicallity of the game better, but by no means does that cover an objective scale ranging all the way to being a hundred percent sure that everyone shares your self-summoned "facts." A hundred percent? A hundred percent! You can never be a solid hundred-percent sure about anything. But anyways, I hardly see how this (Dreamcast):



Looks better than this (Revolution):



And no I'm not bullshitting these screenshots. These are 100% legit screenshots from both of the games I mentioned. Why would I fake it if we're this deep into it? Also to answer your recurring question, yes, I've 100%'d the Dreamcast version twice. Once on a Dreamcast emulator and once on the iPod version (which unfortunately had some missing features, but the graphics are the same).

[Haruka]

RayFan, I'll only tell you that you aren't alone in your latest opinions.

I'll just note one thing: Everyone's feelings are different.

[Adsolution]

RayFan, I'll only tell you that you aren't alone in your latest opinions.

I'll just note one thing: Everyone's feelings are different.

Exactly. That's something Spiraldoor can't seem to grasp.

Also I'm just clearing something that I might have said that sounded a little self-opinionated: I wasn't putting my relatively emotional self into the body of iHeckler9, I was just stating the principle meaning of what iHeckler9 did vs Spiraldoor.

Spiral, note that I have apologized on one or two occasions of things I've said that weren't correctly said, but you won't. Either because you're too proud or because you actually don't understand.

[Haruka]

Either because you're too proud or because you actually don't understand.

*I think I'm going to be in trouble from now on.*

That's the problem (but I think it is more the "proud" than the second option for most people). In my quotidian life I live and I've met people (it doesn't care now who they are) that I witnessed they having an archetype personality of "I'm always right". In certain ocasions it is quite unpleasant to witness (how many times...) and I don't like that kind of personality. It was quite rare to listen an "I'm sorry" or "It was an error from mine" from them. And when they started to talk in a "centralized" tone, the things started to get ugly.

I don't want to relive memories.

Back to Rayman Revolution, RayFan I don't know if you read my opinions in posts above but perhaps you'll understand my point of view.