Rayman 3 scores

[MandM81]

Meanwhile, you sent a PM to DTUCC in which you tried to trade an IPG you found in CF3 against our combos in TOTL months ago. This was a direct violation of the agreement. This same IPG has not been published to this day.

I think you as per usual don't get your facts straight and wrap it all up in a bowl of bile.

I sent a PM to CC regarding an IPG on behalf of myself and Maz. We didn't ask for the IPG solution for TOTL, we asked about an unused 107k non - IPG solution CC mentioned in a post quite a while ago now since we were working on a non - IPG walkthrough. Now, this was the time when you defended your secrecy policy vehemently, unlike the present non - secrecy policy. So a trade would be the only way to get some information. However, CC chose secrecy and didn't answer the PM. Not even a thanks, but no thanks did I get.

As for the IPG, we don't use IPGs in our games, as I also mentioned to CC in the PM. However, we have informed the persons in charge of the HoF about this IPG of course. But, as I said we don't use it in our own games and most certainly not in the HoF.

[MandM81]

i was actuzally referring to screenshots as a sufficient documentation for your scores.

There you go.

[DTUCC]

i really don't know if i was that unclear about my point or if you're just pretending to not understand, but there's still about 20k points missing for valitation in other levels.

in regards to the pm you sent me back than, i simply did not know what the best course of action was because trading one fining for another through pms is not the way i wanted to go. to be perfectly honest, even now i would not know what to reply to the pm. it's not the way i want to go. and thus, i'm not thankful for such a course of action.

[MandM81]

in regards to the pm you sent me back than, i simply did not know what the best course of action was because trading one fining for another through pms is not the way i wanted to go. to be perfectly honest, even now i would not know what to reply to the pm. it's not the way i want to go. and thus, i'm not thankful for such a course of action.

Well, you could have asked politely about it at the time. But at least I'm grateful you don't turn it into a fit of rage and character assasination.

[sfn42]

@MandM: Using something as trade bait that you were, by the agreement we made, obliged to publish anyway, is disgusting. And sending information to some random mod or whatever is not publishing. You made the agreement about IPG-publication with the members of the scoring community, that is CC, Cut, Mountain Goat, Xenon and myself (I think those are the people who signed the agreement, tell me if I am forgetting anyone) and not with the "persons in charge of the HoF".

[MandM81]

sfn: Get over your obsession with me and get a hobby. I'm done replying to your increasingly hostile and hateful posts.

[sfn42]

Fine my me. All your recent posts have done, was: twist the facts, throw false accusations around, deliberately miss the point and play the victim. I can gladly do without that. If you're ever ready to discuss the issues about secrecy without doing any of that, I'll be glad to listen.

[Mountain Goat]

mandm, it's long overdue to recognize that playing the role of the victimised innocent lamb is far away from being associated with the term "authentic" in light of your contributions.

you are constantly refusing to provide proofs in form of level scores or even screenshots of them (apart from the cf picture). is there any reason why you can't resist to divert attention from this issue?

But I don't see that it is necessary to put IPG scores into the HoF since it creates such disharmony.

you are making it sound as if the mere incorporation of ipg-scores stirs up negative potential. actually, no. it is your attitude.
i really want to understand your intentions and motives, so please enlighten me: what is the problem with entering ipg-scores? it's the discussions revolving around the same topic over and over again causing these troubles, which could be easily resolved, but false pride and lack of cooperation are barely worthy to be called enabling factors for a satisfying solution. and as aforementioned already, the value of the hof in terms of representability is overrated anyway.

sfn: Get over your obsession with me and get a hobby

If that were true we wouldn’t have seen the flaming posts from the TSF above.

[DTUCC]

all this fuss about your level scores and how you don't want to tell us what they are really makes mequestion their legitimacy.

[Mirage]

lol im reading here sincem arch and as i expected your people are not friendly
i mean you all have a fucking problem but srsly i play so many competition game and never came across something like this right here

lol mandm81 youre the biggest faggot i ever met in the internet people like you are the reason why competition is hard to enjoy and why the internet is a terrible place.
i hope you get cancer lol

sorry no one of you did anythng to me personaly but i feel offended because everything in here is ther easeon why i hate teh interenet and playing with most other people. your destroying the gaming culture

no more rayman 3 for me dotn wanna be part of this fuck
fucking shit why did my parents buy me this game please

[DTUCC]

you know, i'm coming from a lot of competetive games with great communities and enjoyable competition and I think i have the same perspective on it as Mirage. as much as i hate the phrasing of it, and trust me i'd never wish someone any illnesses or whatever, he's got a fair point with everything else haha

[Xenon]

Based on the posts made on this page, would it not be an idea for the ipg players (who don't seem to care for their positions on the f f fc f ) to stop uploading scores to the Hof? Nothing against you guys of course, but if you really don't care, it would probably create a more harmonious atmosphere around here, non?

It wouldn't make a difference because this is not about the HoF. It was only MandM who for some reason brought that into the discussion.

I'm not taking sides, and I don't mean to cause offence to anyone. But in front of me I can see two parties, one arguing for openness, progression and teamwork with no regard for hof-positioning, and the other arguing for fair game and a leaderboard that better emblematises ability in Rayman 3. The two positions really don't seem that incompatible from a third person's point of view.

Now, whether the Hof should cater for IPG users is another issue. We all have our personal opinions on that. I respect your stance, and I hope you respect mine. The point I'm trying to make is, if you really believe the Hof is pointless and detrimental to this community, why don't you, whether it's the rightful thing to do or not, disregard it in your gameplay? I for one don't care whether MandM is on top or you or on top or Cc is on top or Cut is on top. I really don't have any ulterior motives beyond the fact I would like to see a more peaceful environment around here.

@maz: it's really refreshing to read your posts in this thread, among all this animosity. I wish you well with tlotld, though, I'm pretty sure you couldn't reach a new maximum even if you managed to string together all the 250 point objects in this part. Regardless, improving combos in this world sounds like a fun and noble quest.

As for me replaying the game, yes, I've promised myself I will purchase a new game in January and pick up where I left off. Can't see myself going too far with it, however.

And as for everyone else, I implore you all to refrain from flaming in this thread. Let's have a sensible discussion and move our differences forward, or nothing at all.

Edit: a merry Christmas to you all. Must not forget that!

[MandM81]

you know, i'm coming from a lot of competetive games with great communities and enjoyable competition and I think i have the same perspective on it as Mirage. as much as i hate the phrasing of it, and trust me i'd never wish someone any illnesses or whatever, he's got a fair point with everything else haha

CC, I have always held you in higher regard than your choice of mates and soul mates shows in your post.

Trying to discredit my score will get you nowhere. I have accepted that last November you didn't want to share anything about TOTL, not even your score after part 1. I got over it. So how you can ask me to validate anything about level scores is beyond me.

It seems to me your attitude towards secrecy is closely connected with you having the upper hand or not. But that's maybe just coincidence?

[Cut]

Since anyone could write this post, it doesn't matter. I have the time so i'll do it.

Trying to discredit my score will get you nowhere. I have accepted that last November you didn't want to share anything about TOTL, not even your score after part 1. I got over it. So how you can ask me to validate anything about level scores is beyond me.

DTUCC posted a screenshot of his score in TOTL, the level he improved. So he is in the position demand the same from you.

It seems to me your attitude towards secrecy is closely connected with you having the upper hand or not. But that's maybe just coincidence?

Having the upper hand is completely irrelevant in this case MandM, how often do I have to repeat that? Have you read anything I wrote yesterday? Secrecy is shit and we had to learn that the hard way. But you Mister are just completely immune against learning. I just can repeat what I wrote yesterday, you are a disappointing person.

I mean, what counts in the end? All this for 6 numbers on a random savegame? I don't want to be part of this scoring community anymore but that's no problem because I have made friends with DTUCC, sfn42 and Mountain Goat in the past 15 months. I can retire in peace. And with my posts yesterday, I tried my best to atleast be even with you. I don't want you to remember as somebody who could not learn from mistakes. I want you to remember as a good Rayman 3 player. What will be left when you retire? Besides 6 numbers on a savegame? What's the matter of all this?

[DTUCC]

cut understands my point exactly. i had my score discredidet by you back than, and rightfully so because i did not prove any validation whatsoever. i realised i made a mistake, and in consequence, i corrected my mistake by revealing what my level score was. will you go the same path or will you keep on making the mistake i managed to correct when i made it?

[MandM81]

Secrecy is shit and we had to learn that the hard way.

15 months is quite a learning curve. And you expect me, or us, to "learn" in two weeks what you spent 15 months on?

Next time, if you (TSF) really want to cooperate and get into a community then you should be prepared to work out difference in opinions, show some patience, keep a civil tone and not resort to personal attacks and hostile posts. That only gets everyone in defensive positions.

[Cut]

15 months is quite a learning curve. And you expect me, or us, to "learn" in two weeks what you spent 15 months on?

Well, I thought that you could have learned the same from the past 15 months. But apparently you must have liked your secrecy back then, otherwise this statement seems a little weird to me!?

Next time, if you (TSF) really want to cooperate and get into a community then you should be prepared to work out difference in opinions, show some patience, keep a civil tone and not resort to personal attacks and hostile posts. That only gets everyone in defensive positions.

MandM, please show me some examples out of my yesterdays posts which you don't find acceptable. Then I'm prepared next time, I neither wanted to attack you personally or was hostile, I just stated my opinion about your behaviour. And these weren't even the important parts of my posts. But maybe you can explain me what your problem is and I can adapt to that. Just because you feel offended by something, that's no reason to ignore everything I wrote. I chose my wording as good as I can and I hoped that I could make you think about that a little. There aren't friendly words for everything, MandM. Same for issues related to myself.

Working out different opinions is an interesting point, have we ever actually "worked out" different opinions? I mean, you still have the same opinion that IPG scores don't belong into the HoF but similar things happened on our side of course. So what do you want to work out? How to handle secrecy? How to deal with the IPG in the hall of fame? Working out an opinion is a quest both sides have to master and until now both sides didn't do the best job on that.

[sfn42]

Based on the posts made on this page, would it not be an idea for the ipg players (who don't seem to care for their positions on the f f fc f ) to stop uploading scores to the Hof? Nothing against you guys of course, but if you really don't care, it would probably create a more harmonious atmosphere around here, non?

It wouldn't make a difference because this is not about the HoF. It was only MandM who for some reason brought that into the discussion.

I'm not taking sides, and I don't mean to cause offence to anyone. But in front of me I can see two parties, one arguing for openness, progression and teamwork with no regard for hof-positioning, and the other arguing for fair game and a leaderboard that better emblematises ability in Rayman 3. The two positions really don't seem that incompatible from a third person's point of view.

Now, whether the Hof should cater for IPG users is another issue. We all have our personal opinions on that. I respect your stance, and I hope you respect mine. The point I'm trying to make is, if you really believe the Hof is pointless and detrimental to this community, why don't you, whether it's the rightful thing to do or not, disregard it in your gameplay? I for one don't care whether MandM is on top or you or on top or Cc is on top or Cut is on top. I really don't have any ulterior motives beyond the fact I would like to see a more peaceful environment around here.

I do disregard the HoF from my gameplay. I have, as a reaction to the recent discussion, removed my score and all my improvements in the last year and half (even though they have been very small because of time constraints and other reasons) have been motivated by the community, the challenge of the game itself and just the fun of it. I don't care who is on top, either, and I fully agree with you that a peaceful environment would be fantastic but that only works if we all make an effort to improve things. I see no such effort from MandM right now, as I have said in my previous posts.

You have a good point about the two positions you mentioned. However, the problem I see with them, is that they focus on different entities as the central aspect of the community: Ours revolves around the community itself, MandM's revolves primarily about the HoF (I think that becomes very obvious in our recent posts). Call me biased, but I think a community built primarily around a leaderboard is stupid. In fact, we've had a lot of that in the past, when secrecy was an accepted part of the game. That, as we all know, didn't work out and ultimately ended in the huge IPG-argument, so I don't understand why we should rebuild the community based on this failed model. As Cut and I have repeatedly stated, we have to learn from the past and sticking to the HoF-based model for us, is just repeating the mistakes of the past, that's why we have spoken vehemently against it. I don't even have a problem if someone cares about the HoF but I have a problem when someone cares so much about the HoF that it affects the community negatively and takes the enjoyment out of participating in the community for myself and other people (and Mirage's post, no matter how crass the wording, is an indication that other people feel the same way).

[DTUCC]

Secrecy is shit and we had to learn that the hard way.

15 months is quite a learning curve. And you expect me, or us, to "learn" in two weeks what you spent 15 months on?

Next time, if you (TSF) really want to cooperate and get into a community then you should be prepared to work out difference in opinions, show some patience, keep a civil tone and not resort to personal attacks and hostile posts. That only gets everyone in defensive positions.

factoring in the combos in FC you#ve been taking over 5 years though :/

[Cut]

Also, there is actually no learning curve. From the moment I started to participate in the exchange of ideas in this forum, I realized how shitty all this secrecy-idea was. The learning curve is actually only a few seconds. Maybe a reason for my impatience.