Rayman 3 scores

[1234]

Cool video, I never thought it would be possible to hit the Hoodstormer with a straight shot like that, gotta try that at some point in the near future.

Thank you. Actually it´s a curved shot, it can barely be seen, but if you look closely, you´ll maybe notice it.

Well, with all these things you´ve mentioned, 450 points might be correct, although it actually still seems quite low.

To the 4+4 gems near the waterfall: As far as i know, the current combo goes like this: You take everything in the first room and in the place with the small spiky things (i think they´re called podocrocks or something like that), then you break the 3 piggybanks, take the gems, take everything else on the right side, kill both slapdashes, climb up and continue with the level above.

If i´m right, you could maybe do the same, but instead of breaking all 3 piggybanks, you break only 2 and, after killing the first slapdash, you could maybe get the throttle copter, take the 4 gems in the cave, renew the throttle copter, take the other 4 gems, run to the slapdash and use the remaining piggybank to keep the combo alive.

The negative side is, that you have to leave the red gem from the piggybank and you also can´t kill the second slapdash with a powerup (maybe you also won´t be able to break the last piggybank for the double amount). Therefor you can get all 8 gems and also all with a powerup. This should mean 270 or 330 points profit, not much, but better than nothing.

To LOTLD 3: I have to change my mind, it is possible to kill the elite monger with a powerup. I guess you wouldn´t believe me, if i hadn´t made a video, so here you go : Elite monger with a powerup

One note: In the video i didn´t take the red gem near the elite monger. I think you can include this gem into the combo. The problem is that with my keyboard i can´t charge my fist, run forwards and run to the left at the same time (there are some other issues with my keyboard, but i think i´ve told that at some point already), so it´s hard to test for me.

With this method we will lose 100 points for not taking the yellow gem behind the statue and further 100 points for taking the yellow gem on your way to the cage. Maybe you can pass the last mentioned gem somehow or maybe the other way you´ve showed in your video is fast enough?

Edit: I forgot to say, that i noticed, that in your calculations for LOTLD part 3 you (and honestly i as well) forgot the 140 points we can get from lowering the 2 mushrooms and taking the 2 yellow gems. So the sources outside of the combo would be the first tower, the 130 Points from the first Hoodblaster and those 140 points.

[Maz]

Thanks for the suggestion, but I've already dealt with the problem in LOTLD1, the whole part is officially just one Combo now!

I killed the first Slapdash, ran towards the Throttle Copter, took the Red Gem while jumping up, took the 4 Gems in the cave, rolled off and renewed the Throttle Copter, rolled again to reach the Yellow Gem on time (really hard to do), and after taking the Red Gem I ran towards the second Slapdash to kill him (INCREDIBLY hard to do, you have to shoot at the Slapdash before you even get the red circle), then I threw the plum on the stick and moved on. I have that first part on video, I'm just waiting with the upload until I got the last room recorded as well; I've managed "Red Gem"-"Yellow Gem (jumping on the turtle)"-"Yellow Gem"-"Pig"-"Pig (seems it's impossible to keep up the Combo by using just one Piggybank)" in one Combo (which is also recorded), and I also have a video proving that you can kill the Hoodmonger with one shot after breaking the second Piggybank. It's just that - for esthetical reasons - I've yet to get everything on the same try, but if you're satisfied with what I just mentioned, I could upload those 3 videos now, and try to get a clean run on the final room later on.

Like I said, I sadly had to give up on the 6 Yellow Gems from the second Pig in the last room, and due to a necessary change in the structure of the Combo, it's also not possible to get the Yellow Gem at the entrance to the secret room within the same Combo (at least I think it isn't), but thanks to pretty much everything now being one Combo, it would still win 540 Points, I believe (it should be 30.270 as opposed to the 2-Combo-Amount of 29.730 Points), so I'm happy with that.

To LOTLD 3: I have to change my mind, it is possible to kill the elite monger with a powerup. I guess you wouldn´t believe me, if i hadn´t made a video, so here you go

Wow. That had me speechless for a second.

This is incredible and makes many Combos and ideas a lot more viable, especially your idea for the long Combo, you did a really great job in solving that problem!

By the way, not only did we forget about the Mushrooms and the Gems, but also, we completely overlooked the 20 + 20 = 40 Points which come from comboing the first Hoodblaster with the Wooden Door (going by past experiences, those are really easy to overlook in calculations), lol. I guess I'll try to add up all the Points we have at the moment, and post a revised Point-Value-Overview in the near future. Thanks for pointing that out!

[Maz]

Sorry 'bout double posting, but here's the overview:

G - Green Gem
Hb - Hoodblaster
Hm - Hoodmonger
Hs - Hoodstormer
Hd - Hoodoo
Ma - Matuvu
Mu - Mushroom
P - Piggybank
Po - Podocrock
R - Red Gem
Y - Yellow Gem

As always, if something starts with a capital letter, it's taken with a Powersuit, otherwise it's taken without one.

Part 1

Pokémon-Combo
Basic: 5.500
Combo: 24.750
Total: 30.250 (30.250)
Y Y Y Po Po|Po Po Po Po Y|Y Y Y Y Y|R Y Y R Y|R R R Y R Y R Ma R Y Y Y R R Y R Po Po Po Po Po Po P P Y Y Y Y R Y R Y R P R Mu Y Y Y R Y Y Y R Sd R Y Y Y Y Y Y R sd r Y Y R Hb Hb Sd P Sd Hb R Y Y Y Y Y R y y p p hm hm hm y hs Y Y Y Y Mu Y Y R Y Y R Hb Hb Y

Yellow Gem
Total: 20 (30.270)

Green-Gem-Combo
Basic: 3.450
Combo: 10.280
Total: 13.730 (44.000)
Y Y Y Y Y|Y Y Y Y Y|G Y Y Y Y|Y Y Y Y y|y y y y y y y y

Shoe
Basic: 300
Combo: 420
Total: 720 (44.720)

Wooden Door
Total: 20 (44.740)

Score after Part 1: 44.740

Part 2

Hoodmonger, Hoodblaster, Hoodstormer
Basic: 360
Combo: 200
Total: 560 (560)

Balloon-Combo
Basic: 1.310
Combo: 4.400
Total: 5.710 (6.270)
r y y y y|r hm Y Y Y|Y R R Hs Y|Y Y Y Y Y|Hm Hs Y Y Y Y Y

3 Yellow Gems
Basic: 60
Combo: 40
Total: 100 (6.370)

Mushroom, 3 Yellow Gems
Basic: 80
Combo: 60
Total: 140 (6.510)

Matuvu-Tribelle-Combo
Basic: 2.180
Combo: 7.960
Total: 10.140 (16.650)
Y R R P Hb|Hb Y Y Y Y|Y Y Y Y Y|Y Y Y Y R|Y Y P T P Y Y Y P Ma R Y

Grim Keeper
Total: 560 (17.210)

Yellow Gem
Total: 20 (17.230)

Green-Gem-Combo
Basic: 3.280
Combo: 9.720
Total: 13.000 (30.230)
Y Y Y y y|y y y y y|Y Y Y G y|y y y y y|y y y

2 Yellow Gems
Basic: 40
Combo: 20
Total: 60 (30.290)

Yellow Gem
Total: 20 (30.310)

Wooden Door
Total: 20 (30.330)

Hoodlum-Combo
Basic: 1.150
Combo: 3.320
Total: 4.470 (34.800)
y y y r p|r y y y p|hd y y y hb|hb hm hm hm P|R

Hoodblaster
Total: 260 (35.060)

Score after Part 2: 79.800

Part 3

Hoodblaster, Wooden Door
Basic: 150
Combo: 20
Total: 170 (170)

Stairs-Combo
Basic: 620
Combo: 1.880
Total: 2.500 (2.670)
Y Y Y Y Y|Y Y Y Y R|Y R Y Y Y|Y Y Y Y Y|Y Y Y Y Y Y Y

2 Red Gems, 5 Yellow Gems
Basic: 220
Combo: 280
Total: 500 (3.170)

2 Mushrooms, 2 Yellow Gems
Basic: 80
Combo: 60
Total: 140 (3.310)

Yellow Gem
Total: 20 (3.330)

Yellow Gem
Total: 20 (3.350)

Score before the big Combo: 83.150


I can't say anything for sure as long as we don't have a finalized version, but if the Combo were to work out like you hope it would, we should be about 12.000 Points short right now. The list above may not be perfect (if someone's still reading up to this point: Has anyone ever gotten more than 10.280 Points out of the Green-Gem-Combo in Part 1?), but 12.000 Points... that's gonna be difficult to compensate for, to say the least.

The only small improvements I can see in Part 1 would be to a) use only 1 Pig in the final room to keep the Combo alive, so that you can take the Yellow Gems with the Vortex later on, and to b) take the Yellow Gem in front of the secret room in Combo. Putting aside those up to 880 Points, Part 1 should be pretty much unimprovable by now. Also, the only other improvement which I can see in Part 3 would be to get ALL the stairs into one single Combo. I've tried this in the past, and recently gave it a shot again, but I've not yet succeeded in doing so. That being said, we have to go berserk in Part 2, seeing how that's almost our only source of improvement. On that note, players who use the IPG in LOTLD2 might be able to almost reach the necessary Score, so who knows...

[1234]

Thanks a lot for the overview. The new Pokémon-combo (what a creativity ) in part 1 is really cool now, well done. A clean run on the final room would be awesome of course, but if you upload the 3 videos, it also would be great too see them and furthermore it´d be completely enough at first; i mean they´re showing how to do it and that´s the most important thing.

Also good, that you didn´t forget the 40 points for the door in part 3. When i was investigating the part, i always broke the door, but i still completely forgot about the points.

Thanks to the overview we can quite easily see, where we could get further points. Let me make some theoretical calculations:

- In the huge combo we take red gems as number 16 and 19 --> 80 points.
- In the huge combo we take the slapdash and the red gem without a powerup --> 360 points (unlikely, unless we completely change the beginning of the combo).
- In the huge combo we use both piggybanks to keep the combo alive instead of only one --> 780 points
- We don´t include the yellow gem at the entrance of the secret room --> 100 points
- In the green gem combo we take only 19 gems with a powerup. Assuming 20 are possible --> 50 points

That´s pretty much every improvement i can somehow imagine (but i have no concrete idea how to do that yet, so all these mentioned things might be impossible; especially the second one). Assuming all that would be possible we could get further 1370 points, that means 46110 points after part 1. --> We have to find AT LEAST 10000 points in part 2 and part 3.

I haven´t taken a look at part 2 yet, but i still doubt that without further glitches we would be able to get those 10k points in part 2 and 3.

However with a SJ in part 3 maybe we would be able to get lots of points (and also improve the potential maximum by quite a big amount).
Let´s assume, that we can perform a(n) (E)SJ at the beginning of part 3 to skip the wooden door and also that everything would be triggered correctly. In this case we could be able to include the hoodblaster and maybe even the door into the combo and we also could kill the other hoodblaster walking on the scaffolding. The best combo i could imagine then would be the following:

After killing the hoodblaster in the hallway, break both piggybanks, get the 2 gems on the small scaffolding, kill the hoodblaster, get the HMF, take the 5 gems on the stone, perform a SJ, kill the hoodblaster on the scaffolding, take the 8 gems behind the scaffolding.

I don´t know the exact amount of additional points, but it would most certainly give you literally thousands of extra points.
So, do anyone know a way to skip this wooden door? [problem is solved already. See the edit below]
A SJ can be performed on the stone with the 5 gems (as you can see in the most speedruns), but firstly i don´t know, whether it can be used to skip the door and secondly we would have to take at least some of those 5 gems because of the SJ.

Further theoretical improvements in part 3 might be:
- pass the yellow gem on your way to the cage (the improvement i mentioned in my previous post) to be able to include it into the final combo --> 100 points
- Get more gems with a powerup in the final combo --> ?
- Improve the stairs combo --> ?

That´s every improvement in part 1 and part 3 i can imagine by now. The most important thing is to be able to skip the wooden door in part 3. Any help for that is appreciated.

(I hope my next posts won´t be as long as my last few ones ...)

Edit: I guess my post will be even longer now, but it´s definitely worth it. I started playing a little bit and found following:
1.) In part 3 it´s possible to skip the yellow gem as you run to the cage without having to press the strafe button --> 100 Points
2.) It is possible to skip the wooden door by using the SJ on the stone and EVERYTHING will work fine. The only difference is, that the hoodblaster in the hallway will be invisible, but you can still kill him. You can do everything you have to do and when you return, both hoodblaster will be there (that means the one on the scaffolding too).
I guess we came our goal much nearer. The only improvement of that would be to skip the wooden door without having to take any gem.

[Maz]

Green-Gem-Combo for 10.320 Points
Postponed taking the Gems from one of the pillars as you can see, and it paid off. I'm almost tempted to say that perfect movement allows for an additional 60 Points (see for example how I landed on that pillar after taking the Green Gem - ideally, you would take the 2 Gems while just falling to the ground).

Beginning of the Pokémon-Combo
Absolutely disgusting to play. Even when using Swift throughout the Combo and Quick Attack on that problematic Slapdash, this is almost impossible. By the way, you can't see it in the video, but if you rush like hell, you can get the Red Gem with the Heavy-Metal-Fist, too (which further adds to the difficulty of this Combo). Also, this video is "old", don't forget that one has to take the other Gem at the very end.

Red-Yellow-Yellow-Pig-Pig-Connection
You will see this in the other video as well; if the third Hoodmonger doesn't come down immediately, run towards the spot shown in the vid, that will trigger him. Watch out at the end, the camera tends to be wacky.

Pig-Hoodmonger
Now the Hoodmonger decided to be a bastard and took a favourable spot, but I guarantee you that you can kill him even if he runs to his usual position. Also, forget about Matuvus, the real "Blue Menace" is Globox. If I could, I would eat his legs so he would stop running around being a cockblock... I already ran out of Combo-Time because he denied me access to the Vortex, so be careful that this doesn't happen to you during the actual Combo.

The part of the Combo which is shown in the latter 2 videos requires perfectly timing your shots at the Pigs and the Hoodmonger, which is why I just won't get everything at once. Well, you'll get the idea.

By the way, your idea of using an SJ might be a good idea, but why would you make the end so complicated? Even if it's difficult, I've managed to kill the final Hoodblaster from below even when he stood in the middle of the bridge, so why wouldn't you just shoot the first Hoodblaster from on top of the platform, then send a curved shot towards that second Hoodblaster, and drop down to activate the Heavy-Metal-Fist before your fist reaches him? Maybe you have your reasons, but personally, I would not want to end a Combo like that with having to rely on succeeding in a random SJ.

Finally: I don't know if this helps/provides enough time, but at the beginning of the big Combo, you can go inbetween the first and the second Yellow Gem without taking anything, which is at least a bit shorter than the usual way. Maybe this is what we need to keep all Yellow Gems on the Map?

[1234]

Cool videos! Should we ever reach a new maximum in LOTLD, this will probably be the hardest level. Sadly it seems, that you really need both piggybanks to keep the combo alive.

In the green gem combo it might be better to roll to the first two gems at the beginning instead of jumping. Maybe this would give you enough time to take the yellow gem between the 13th and 14th gem which you take in your video?

To the SJ in part 3: Of course your way would be much easier, but with the way i described above, we could even include the 8 gems behind the gate into the combo. I just mentioned that way, in case we should need these points for a theoretical maximum. I don´t know how consistent this SJ is, but for "real" playing it´s probably far too hard, unless the success rate is very high.

Finally: I don't know if this helps/provides enough time, but at the beginning of the big Combo, you can go inbetween the first and the second Yellow Gem without taking anything, which is at least a bit shorter than the usual way. Maybe this is what we need to keep all Yellow Gems on the Map?

Maybe that´s fast enough as well, but actually you can play the same way as shown in my video and pass the yellow gem (what in my video can´t be seen, since i took this gem accidently before) without having to press the strafe button. I told that in my last post already, but i must admit, that it wasn´t really clearly described.
Anyway, i´ll try that and see, whether it´s possible, but actually i´m quite sure it is.

Edit: I´ve found a way to get further 80 points at the beginning of the Pokémon combo. The first 20 items are just yellow gems and podocrocks. I´ve recorded an attempt. Beginning of the Pokémon-Combo

Edit 2: This evening i took a look at LOTLD part 2 and found a way to get the vortex at the beginning. No worries, it´s quite easy.
Vortex at the beginning
I don´t know, what combo would be the best now. One combo, what might work, would be the following:
Take the gems on all 7 balloons, kill the hoodstyler, renew the vortex, fall down and get the 6 gems on the ground, kill the hoodblaster and the hoodstormer, jump/roll into the water and lower the mushroom, get all gems in this area (probably you have to play this part very slow to make sure the hoodlums will be on their right position after you take the last gem), kill the hoodstyler, get the lockjaw, kill both hoodstormer, use the hook to get on the platform with the last hoodstyler, kill him as late as possible and finish the combo with the 4 yellow gems.
I´m not sure, whether this will completely work, but with the vortex at the beginning we can most likely win a few thousand points.

[Lance]

About FC:

As i said in my previous post, it´s probably possible to improve the ending of the matuvu combo in FC2 by either 20 or 40 points. I´ve found out that those 40 points are possible.
(To make the improvement more understandable, at first some clarifications: After you take the last gem on the trampolines, you fall down. Down there you can see 3 red gems on some mushrooms, 5 yellow gems on the ground (i´ll call the lowest gem „1st gem on the ground“ and the gem, what is nearest to the bridge „5th gem on the ground“), 1 red gem behind a stone, a matuvu and 3 yellow gems on the bridge (i´ll call the gem as you enter the bridge „1st gem on the bridge“))
The ending of the matuvu combo:
After falling down: 1st and 2nd gem on the ground, 1 of 3 red gems, 3rd, 4th and 5th gem on the gound, 1st gem on the bridge, red gem, 2nd gem on the bridge, matuvu, 3rd gem on the bridge, 2 of 3 red gems.

So this combo would be YYYYY|YYYYY|YYYYY|RYYYY|RYMaYRR.
I'm having a bit of trouble getting Matuvu in the way you described. I grab the 1st yellow gem on the bridge, then take the red gem, then I take the 2nd gem on the bridge, but when I try to get Matuvu, I run out of combo time. Is there a trick to getting Matuvu in a combo right after taking the 2nd yellow gem?

[Maz]

I'm having a bit of trouble getting Matuvu in the way you described. I grab the 1st yellow gem on the bridge, then take the red gem, then I take the 2nd gem on the bridge, but when I try to get Matuvu, I run out of combo time. Is there a trick to getting Matuvu in a combo right after taking the 2nd yellow gem?

There's this thing called the "Matuvu-Trick"; just before you'd take the Yellow Gem, enter the Look-Mode. Then let go of the button, walk forward so you get the Gem, and then quickly go into Look-Mode again and get the Matuvu. This makes it a little easier because the camera needs time to go back to its fixed state after leaving Look-Mode, and if you are quick enough, you can re-enter the Look-Mode before the camera goes back to its initial position, meaning you can zoom in faster, so to say. It's still incredibly hard though (...is what I think - I never actually succeeded in getting the Matuvu in a Combo like that).

Nice find with the Vortex. I guess your Combo is indeed the best way to play this, any other - theoretically more profitable - Combo would have a Powersuit run out at some Point. A few thousand Points is a VERY optimistic estimate though.
Going by my IPG-Experiences with this Part, if you get the Vortex this way (before you have access to the Lockjaw), the 2 Hoodblasters we're currently using for the Matuvu-Tribelle-Combo won't appear. That alone could cost us 1.140 Points. I'll have to have a look at this for myself though, to confirm that this will happen when not using an IPG, too. But for now, thanks for the update!

[Lance]

About FC:

As i said in my previous post, it´s probably possible to improve the ending of the matuvu combo in FC2 by either 20 or 40 points. I´ve found out that those 40 points are possible.

Yes, it is possible. I can confirm that, I just made a 2370 points Matuvu Combo in FC2:



I'm playing on PCSX2 emulator, and I used savestates to do that combo. But the point is - it's definitely possible to do it on PS2. I just don't see myself ever being skilled enough to do it without savestates.

[Lance]

The Fairy Council:
00000 – 00000 – 00000 – 00000 → Part 1
01100 – 03540 – 04640 – 04640 → Part 2
03320 – 11330 – 14650 – 19290 → Part 3

Can I ask how to achieve 14650 points in FC3? So far I managed to get 14630 points there (so I'm missing 20 points).
Here is what I do:
- 5 Piggy Combo = 90 points
- 3 Matuvu Combo = 11020 points
- 13 Yellow Gem Combo in the spiral hall = 720 points
- YYYYY|RRYYY|Ma Combo = 2720 points
- Two Yellow Gem on the left side of the 1st room = 60 points
- The last Yellow Gem = 20 points
Total: 14630 points.

Where am I missing the 20 points? I play the PS2 NTSC-U version, if that makes any difference.

[1234]

Well done Lance, 2370 points in the matuvu combo is really great, even though it´s played with savestates.
To your question: You can include "The last Yellow Gem" into the last matuvu combo. Cut once recorded an attempt. You can see it here.
I actually don´t know much about it, but is that, what you do something like a TAS (in this case it might stand for "Tool-assisted Scorerun" )? Will you upload some videos then? It would be interesting to see e.g. a successful video of the matuvu combo in FC 2, even if it´s not "normally" played.

To LOTLD part 2: I calculated the points you´d get from the combo; it´d be 9550 points (Since you have to play the part in the water very slowly, the vortex will probably run out at some point. I calculated the points for the case, that you have to take the last 4 gems without a powerup, but it could be also more or less). In your overview you calculated 6410 points for the same items, that means we´d win 3140 points, in case i didn´t miscalculate.
I remember, that you mentioned the issue with the two hoodblaster, when you were testing the IPG. Yesterday i tried it quickly (that means i took the vortex at the beginning, tried (and failed) to play the new combo and then checked, whether the two hoodblaster would be there). On the first try they appeared, on the second try they didn´t and on the third try they appeared again.
I have no idea, why that happened, maybe it´s better, when you take a look at it by yourself. I think though, that we won´t have to give up the 1140 points.

[Maz]

I've looked into your Combo in LOTLD2 again. Sadly, I think that it doesn't work the way it is now; I played the Combo in a way that I killed the second Hoodstormer before going into the water, and even then, the Hoodstyler had barely landed. Now for the good news: If you DO finish off the second Hoodstormer early on as I described, the Combo is not only possible, but actually pretty easy, too (minus the SJ to get to the Vortex, that one is super annoying). I'll be more than happy to be proven wrong, but I think you can't play the Combo using just one Hoodstormer in the beginning. That being said, I took a look at how many points this would gain:

New Balloon-Combo
Basic: 2.060
Combo: 6.770
Total: 8.830 (8.830)

4 Yellow Gems on the platform next to the Vortex
Basic: 80
Combo: 60
Total: 140 (8.970)

Together with the 100 Points from the Yellow Gems near the Hooks, that leads to a grand total of 9.070 Points in this first room with the new way. Now for the old way:

Hoodlums
Basic: 360
Combo: 200
Total: 560 (560)

Balloon-Combo
Basic: 1.310
Combo: 4.400
Total: 5.710 (6.270)

Mushroom, 3 Yellow Gems
Basic: 80
Combo: 60
Total: 140 (6.410)

Add the 100 Points to that, and you'll end up at 6.510. So in total, your way gains 2.560 Points, which is a huge improvement.

By the way, I never had the Hoodlums not appearing either. I don't know why they don't stay away anymore, but eh, I'll take it.

[Lance]

Well done Lance, 2370 points in the matuvu combo is really great, even though it´s played with savestates.
To your question: You can include "The last Yellow Gem" into the last matuvu combo. Cut once recorded an attempt. You can see it here.
I actually don´t know much about it, but is that, what you do something like a TAS (in this case it might stand for "Tool-assisted Scorerun" )? Will you upload some videos then? It would be interesting to see e.g. a successful video of the matuvu combo in FC 2, even if it´s not "normally" played.

Thanks for the reply. It took me a few hours with the use of savestates and slowdowns to reach 4640 points in FC2. I don't have a recording, and I don't want to do FC2 again. That 2370 points in Matuvu combo is just too painfully hard to do.
I actually modified your route a bit. At the end of Matuvu combo, I grabbed the 1st Yellow Gem on the bridge, then looked at Matuvu, then went for Red Gem on the left side, then grabbed 2nd and 3rd Yellow Gem on the bridge, then rolled towards the 2nd and 3rd Red Gem on the mushrooms. The hardest part was obviously getting Matuvu after the 1st Yellow Gem on the bridge. Still, I believe it's easier than taking the route you described (1st Yellow Gem on the bridge, Red Gem in the corner, 2nd Yellow Gem on the bridge, Matuvu, 3rd Yellow Gem on the bridge, 2nd and 3rd Red Gem on the mushrooms).

I actually managed to get 14690 points in FC3, which is 40 more than the "theoretical max" you predicted.
Here is what I did. Let me just say it's probably humanly impossible to do this. It took me 1 hour with slowdown and multiple savestates.
- 5 Piggy Combo = 90 points
- 3 Matuvu Combo = 11020 points
- 13 Yellow Gem Combo in the spiral hall = 720 points
- Two Yellow Gem on the left side of the 1st room = 60 points
- YYYYY|YRRYY|YMa Combo = 2800 points. This is where the difference in points was created. I went counter-clockwise in the 1st room, grabbing 6 Yellow Gems and then 2 Red Gems on the upper part, then jumped down to take three Yellow Gems on the right side of the room, followed with grabbing Matuvu at the end of the combo. The real challenge is finishing this combo before Vortex runs out. I think it's not humanly possible, it's TAS-level of precision in movement. It's very hard to do even with savestates and slowdowns.
Total: 14690 points.

I would also want to ask: does the following route give the „theoretical maximum” score in FC4? Is it possible to improve it somehow? This is what I do:
- yHoYYY|YYYYY|MuMuYYR|YYMa = 3780 points (first room). I start with the Yellow Gem nearest to the Hoodblaster, kill the Hoodblaster, take the Vortex, SJ to the Yellow Gem in front of Tribelle, take the 3 Yellow Gems on the vines, take the 4 Yellow Gems on the platforms, shoot 2 Mushrooms, jump where the 5 Gems are, take them in order YYRYY, take the Matuvu. The ending of this combo could be improved, if it was possible to take three Yellow Gems before taking a Red Gem (this would improve it by 60 points). However, I've tried many times and I believe it's not possible to take 3 Yellow Gems in a row.
- YMaYYY|Tr = 2640 points (room with 1st Tribelle). I start with the Yellow Gem at the top (if you walk slowly, you can get it while standing at the top), then take the Matuvu, then helicopter down to take 3 Yellow Gems and land near Tribelle to score her.
- YYYYY|R = 360 points (room after the 1st Tribelle).
- ySlYYMu|YYYFaP|PPPPP|FaFaMuAn = 2710 points (room with fairies). Sl = Slapdash, Fa = Fairy, Po = Podocrock, An = Andre. I start by taking Yellow Gem to the right of Slapdash, shoot Slapdash and take the Vortex, take the 1st and 3rd Yellow Gem, shoot the Mushroom, take the Yellow Gem on the 2nd Mushroom, take the Yellow Gem on the 1st Mushroom, take the Yellow Gem near the Vortex, quickly take the Fairy located on the right wall near the exit, charge fist to shoot Podocrock, use SJ to reach the middle Fairy on the left wall, roll to the next Fairy, shoot Mushroom and take Andre in the middle of the room.
- YYYY + R = 200 points (the path leading to the next room).
- YYYYMu|YYYYY|RYYYCr|RYYYY|CrTr = 5260 points. This is the route shown on videos.
Total: 14950 points in FC4.

[1234]

To LOTLD 2: 2560 points is still great. Next week i´ll calculate the points we can get so far and how many we still need. I don´t know, but i think we´re not too far away from a new maximum. Sadly i´ve no good idea for an improvement left, but i have not given up yet.

Lance: I didn´t know, that you can do such a last matuvu combo without making the vortex run out too fast (when i tried that combo a few weeks ago i was too slow). I think, now the "theoretical maximum" should be around 50900 points; with savestates and slowdowns maybe even around 51000.

To the combo in FC 4: I have to ask you something before: Does the combo you described actually work? Taking the single yellow gem in front of the tribelle after the SJ should be possible, but how do you get the 3 gems on the vine after taking this gem?
Anyway, if you can do this, i could imagine, that following combo would work: Start on the edge of the small platform with the 5 gems, take exactly one yellow gem while rolling off and kill the hoodblaster in combo, take the vortex, perform the SJ, get the single yellow gem more on the left side, jump up and take the other single gem, now do whatever you do to take the 3 gems on the vine and continue as usual.
--> yHoYYY|YYYYY|YMuMuYY|RYMa

If this combo works, it can´t be improved anymore, unless you can do one of these things:
- Include more items into the combo (The nearest item should be the tribelle, but i couldn´t combine the tribelle with the single yellow gem yet. Also even if you could do that, it still won´t necessarily mean an improvement; we´d have to think about a sick combo yet)
- Start the combo with a powerup (The nearest powerup should be the vortex from the fairy room. You should be able to return to the first room, but most likely the powerup would run out. I haven´t tried it yet though.)

These are the only theoretical improvements of the combo, but i doubt, that any of these two will work.

To the Fairy room combo (with André): You can do this combo for another 40 points:

1. Collect the yellow gem on the right side and kill the slapdash in combo. Get the Vortex
2. Take the 3 yellow gems and screw the mushroom. Take the gem and roll towards the platform right before the hedghehogs.
3. Use exactly 3 hedghehogs to keep the combo alive while you jump to the first Fairy with the trampolines
4. Fall down and kill a hedghehog. Reload the Vortex and kill another hedghehog
5. Jump right towards the 2nd mushroom, screw it and take the gem. Kill the final hedghehog
6. Continue as always

2750 total points, 2070 combo points

Another improvement of this combo might be done as follows (i haven´t tried it yet though):

A few days ago i´ve found two videos, which could help to improve FC part 4 by some further points, unfortunately by means of glitches.
The idea is to start the fairy hole combo equipped with a powerup.
In this video at ~0:45 you can see how to get from the fairy room to the last room. After you have played the tribelle combo, you can take the vortex and do this glitch to return to the fairy room.
Depending on how long the vortex will last you can improve the combo by 70 or, in the unlikely event you can kill the slapdash after taking at least 5 items, 110 points. I doubt, that i´ll use this glitches, but they may lead to 50.880 or maybe even 50.920 points, i think.

All the other things you mentioned are optimal i think. Good luck with it.

[Lance]

I think I'm done with FC for now. I'm pretty satisfied with my scores. I'm aware that FC4 can be improved by skipping the Fairy room, taking the Vortex in last room, then coming back to Fairy room and then combo with Vortex already on. But the problem is, I wasn't able to recreate the Fairy room skip. In that TAS video, Rayman clipped through the ceiling in Fairy room. However, the ceiling is solid in my game, so it's impossible to do this glitch for me.

On the other hand, I've discovered a new skip in the passage leading from Fairy room to the last room. This of course means you must first clear Fairy room to use this skip. After climbing up, do a SJ and glide to the last room. The ceiling on the top of the climbing wall isn't solid, so it's possible to pass through there.

Here are my scores (played on PS2 emulator):
FC2: 4640
FC3: 19330
FC4: 34280
FC5: 42640
FC6: 50830

It might be possible to break 51.000 if I could find a way to glitch through the ceiling in the Fairy room in FC4. I will re-play the level if someone can teach me how to skip the Fairy room.

By the way, in FC3, is it possible to fall down from the room with Vortex to the 1st room? I know it's possible to do it the other way (from 1st room into the room with Vortex). If we could find a way to fall down through the floor or wall, it could be possible to extend the 3 Matuvu combo even more.

[Lance]

To the combo in FC 4: I have to ask you something before: Does the combo you described actually work? Taking the single yellow gem in front of the tribelle after the SJ should be possible, but how do you get the 3 gems on the vine after taking this gem?

After taking the single Yellow Gem before the vines, you need to run towards the vines and jump late. If you do this right, you should grab the 1st Yellow Gem in the air, and grab the vines far enough to reach the 2nd Yellow Gem during the combo. The trick is jumping at the right moment.

Anyway, if you can do this, i could imagine, that following combo would work: Start on the edge of the small platform with the 5 gems, take exactly one yellow gem while rolling off and kill the hoodblaster in combo, take the vortex, perform the SJ, get the single yellow gem more on the left side, jump up and take the other single gem, now do whatever you do to take the 3 gems on the vine and continue as usual.
--> yHoYYY|YYYYY|YMuMuYY|RYMa

Thank you, this combo works. It gives 40 more points than the combo I used before.

If this combo works, it can´t be improved anymore, unless you can do one of these things:
- Include more items into the combo (The nearest item should be the tribelle, but i couldn´t combine the tribelle with the single yellow gem yet. Also even if you could do that, it still won´t necessarily mean an improvement; we´d have to think about a sick combo yet)
- Start the combo with a powerup (The nearest powerup should be the vortex from the fairy room. You should be able to return to the first room, but most likely the powerup would run out. I haven´t tried it yet though.)

These are the only theoretical improvements of the combo, but i doubt, that any of these two will work.

If anyone comes up with a new sick combo, I'll be glad to test it out.
About starting the combo with a powerup: I can't find a way to clip through the ceiling in Fairy room. Also I can't reproduce the OoB glitch in the last room. If anyone can teach me how to do these, I think breaking 51.000 points in FC will be possible.

To the Fairy room combo (with André): You can do this combo for another 40 points:

1. Collect the yellow gem on the right side and kill the slapdash in combo. Get the Vortex
2. Take the 3 yellow gems and screw the mushroom. Take the gem and roll towards the platform right before the hedghehogs.
3. Use exactly 3 hedghehogs to keep the combo alive while you jump to the first Fairy with the trampolines
4. Fall down and kill a hedghehog. Reload the Vortex and kill another hedghehog
5. Jump right towards the 2nd mushroom, screw it and take the gem. Kill the final hedghehog
6. Continue as always

2750 total points, 2070 combo points

Thanks, I'll try it out tomorrow.

Another improvement of this combo might be done as follows (i haven´t tried it yet though):

A few days ago i´ve found two videos, which could help to improve FC part 4 by some further points, unfortunately by means of glitches.
The idea is to start the fairy hole combo equipped with a powerup.
In this video at ~0:45 you can see how to get from the fairy room to the last room. After you have played the tribelle combo, you can take the vortex and do this glitch to return to the fairy room.
Depending on how long the vortex will last you can improve the combo by 70 or, in the unlikely event you can kill the slapdash after taking at least 5 items, 110 points. I doubt, that i´ll use this glitches, but they may lead to 50.880 or maybe even 50.920 points, i think.

All the other things you mentioned are optimal i think. Good luck with it.

Those glitches are too hard to reproduce for me. Slipping through the ceiling in Fairy Room doesn't seem possible, as the ceiling is solid. Could it be a version difference? For example, the ceiling being solid in PS2 release, but not solid on some other console?

I think the new maximum for FC (without using the Fairy room glitch) will be 50910 points. I should be done with my run tomorrow, so I'll let you know how it went.

[Lance]

Thank you 1234, I've managed to improve my score by 80 points.
The "theoretical max" in FC is now 50910. This could be further improved if we find reliable way of getting Out-of-Bounds in Fairy Room in FC4.
But for now, I'm pretty satisfied. If anyone finds a way to further improve this score, please let me know.

[RibShark]

The "theoretical max" in FC is now 50910. This could be further improved if we find reliable way of getting Out-of-Bounds in Fairy Room in FC4.

There has been a reliable way for quite some time now. Didn't realise that the scorers didn't know about it:
.

All you have to do is make sure you have grabbed a ledge, bounce on the first mushroom and hold directly left on the stick, then hold Y and hit the bottom of the second mushroom. Carry on holding left and you'll clip out the top of the room, and you can helicopter to wherever you need to go. This works on every version, so it is suitable for scoring.

[Lance]

The "theoretical max" in FC is now 50910. This could be further improved if we find reliable way of getting Out-of-Bounds in Fairy Room in FC4.

There has been a reliable way for quite some time now. Didn't realise that the scorers didn't know about it:
.

All you have to do is make sure you have grabbed a ledge, bounce on the first mushroom and hold directly left on the stick, then hold Y and hit the bottom of the second mushroom. Carry on holding left and you'll clip out the top of the room, and you can helicopter to wherever you need to go. This works on every version, so it is suitable for scoring.

Thanks. I'll go back to FC in some time, right now I'm taking a break from that level.

Can I also ask if there's an easy way of getting out of the last room (the room with 2 crabs) in FC4?

[1234]

50910 points in FC is quite cool, some weeks ago i didn´t expect, that we could get that much.
Although i was talking quite a lot about glitches in the last time, i´m neither a big "fan" of them, nor do i know much about all that. So i don´t know, whether we can fall down to the 1st room in FC 3, and i also have no idea, how to get out of the last room in FC 4 (except of the way shown in the video to what i posted the link). If you found a way to do that, i would be interested in it though, especially because i´m curious about the theoretical maximum.

After taking the single Yellow Gem before the vines, you need to run towards the vines and jump late. If you do this right, you should grab the 1st Yellow Gem in the air, and grab the vines far enough to reach the 2nd Yellow Gem during the combo. The trick is jumping at the right moment.

Thanks. Actually i tried that already, but maybe there is a platform difference (i play on PC). As far as i know the PC version has the lowest jump height.

In FC 2, if you could take the red gem behind the stone, then collect the last gem on the bridge and finally roll off and get the 3 red gems on the mushrooms, you could get further 20 points (5 gems on the ground, 2 gems on the bridge, matuvu, red gem, 3rd gem on the bridge, 3 red gems). I´ve never tried that so far, but maybe with your tools you can do this combo?

Are you actually playing "normally" as well. If so, what´s your score then?

Speaking of normal playing, finally i´ve finished FC part 3 with 19060 points. I used an easier version of the last matuvu combo, but i´m still very happy with it.
Now that i´m in part 4, i would have to use the SJ in the first room for the matuvu tribelle combo. Can someone help me with that, please? Where exactly do i have to do the SJ?