Off Topic

[Ambidextroid]

The lives these people lead and the thoughts going through their head can tell us how closely they're following what parts of their scripture, and they aren't required to follow it at all, but that doesn't change the fact that these people are living their lives based partially off of what is in their respective holy books.

"Partially" being the operative word here - radical Muslims follow teachings in the part of their holy book about Sharia law and killing infidels, and the majority of Muslims follow parts in their book about charity and forgiveness. Saying that these well natured Muslims are to blame for not being allowed into the country because they follow some teachings in a book that radical Muslims also get their teachings from is misrepresenting them, similar to how KKK members do not represent Protestantism despite being rooted in Protestant beliefs.

[Adsolution]

I was responding to you saying that there's nothing special about the New Testament, which is just false.

There are key differences in their scripture that account for a significant portion and have aided another significant portion of the violence and intolerance surrounding Islam, and the Culture surrounding many Middle-Eastern countries is founded on a very close interpretation of Islamic scripture. Virtually everyone in those countries are extremely religious, and believe nearly everything written in the Quran.

I don't really want this to turn into a discussion about religion though, there are way more interesting things at hand here.

[Ambidextroid]

I don't really want this to turn into a discussion about religion though, there are way more interesting things at hand here.

Alright, I suppose it's not the most pressing matter. All I was trying to say really is I'm sure there's a better solution and the current "solution" isn't fair or sustainable.

[Keane]

As much as I'm aware of the stupidity of many of Trump's comments, I'm almost relieved that he was elected president.

As a non-American, what matters the most to me is American foreign policy. And God knows how destructive it has been to the world since the Soviet–Afghan War (and possibly much earlier). And in that regard, while Clinton seems to be the continuation of this policy, Trump wants an easing of tensions with Russia, acknowledges that they should never have been to Iraq and that they have destabilized the whole Middle East, and is realistic about al-Assad being bad while not stupidly trying to get rid of him as he knows well that jihadists would take over.

I agree he's flat out better on these issues, he seems to want to take everything a step back and be a little more nuanced, and I can get behind that. Clinton was too much a warhawk and I'm glad we dodged that bullet.

Trump is a big mouth. He's not gonna do half the things he said. Hell, he can't even do half the things he said (he's not almighty, neither is the senate, and they don't have to agree with him because they're from the same party). He's a populist, he said things to please, to get elected, but now he's in the office, he will realize (if he hasn't already) that most of the stuff is not doable.

His bombastic ideas won't happen, there's not gonna be a wall, but I think he will get quite a lot done. He'll totally gut the FDA and EPA (food and enviromental agencies), he can give the fossil fuel industries free game, he can elect a very corporatist person as FCC chairman (internet regulation), he'll be best buddies with the NSA who he's even come out and defended/supported a couple times. He'll apply trickledown economics - who's gonna stop him? The republican Senate and House, they overwhelmingly support that system.

Bonus: "No, when I said the TPP is a terrible deal I meant until I amended it to be great! I'm the most pro-TPP person ever! It'll be the best deal, best one in years!"

(except for his positions on climate change, I really hope he doesn't fuck this one up).

He wants the gut the EPA and stop the Paris agreement, he doesn't even believe it exists. Leading environmental organizations are going to have to channel themselves more effectively than ever before - devolving our current broken environmental protection in this time period is a worst case scenario.

What I find to be a complete joke is that people who were well-aware of the fact they're both absolutely terrible candidates have become so utterly devastated over Trump winning - and yes, this goes for a number of people from RPC as well, especially when all they can think of at this point are "the rights of women, Muslims, LGBT people and so on", but I'll get back to that - get your shit straight you agonisingly self-absorbed retards. I have sympathy for those directly affected by any of the negative policies he'll actually end up enforcing, but the alternative is living in fear for the safety of the world itself. The last thing the country needs right now is a corrupt, slimy, war-bent politician in office. Just like with Brexit, all I hear people complaining about is how the this will affect them in the most immediate, trivial fashion ("My college/studies funding is going to be dropped, higher shipping taxes, my religion is looked down upon!!"); I'm not American or British, but if I were, I would not have the gall to lie to myself like that.

That's because you're friends are all stupid and dumbhomo, ad.

No but seriously, I think you're completely right. I really have a distaste for the social justice type movement at this point, their whole agenda feels incredible self-serving and like it's turning politics into something fashionable with labels to show off. If you really want a progressive future for the country then this election should upset you because it means there are people without proper healthcare, or that climate change is being ignored, not that this "new americana" movement didn't get validated by the final result - and you should've been just as angeree if Hillary won. Whooptiefuckingdoo, you're not a bigot in 2016.

Not me trying to dismiss the existence of these issues and there's a lot of progress left to be made, but I fail to see why so many people push these specific issues like they're the most pressing matters in politics, as if women's rights was the primary win or lose issue of the election. If anything, I think many of these socio-political issues have already begun to progress to a point where they're inevitably going to be signed into law by someone very soon.

And of course Hillary talked about those issues all the time, she wanted to tap in on that and score minority votes. It was the only thing she really could talk about, because there is no single payer healthcare or breaking up banks in her agenda, and it's a safe discussion topic that by default she has the upperhand on against a conservative. Again, the fact that her whole campaign's thing was "we're not racist!" is pathetic, that shouldn't be the main advertising point of a Democratic candidate in 2016, it should be a given.

- Muslims: Islam is not a race, it's a belief system. Trump's ideas are brash, but to be perfectly honest, I don't really find much morally reprehensible about not allowing people who identify (emphasis on "identify") with a religion that has a tendency to produce radicals from entering the country. It's like closing the borders for the KKK: Why the fuck would you even identify with something founded on violence, bigotry, intolerance and racism if you're neither violent, bigoted, intolerant nor racist?

Trump never addresses the implications of that policy properly. He's never once namedropped the Muslims who have risked their lives opposing radicalism and liberating Syrians from ISIS. It would've been a very different conversation if Trump had come out and acknowledged these people, made some very clear strong points debunking racism accusations, and announced it going "I know it's harsh, I want it lifted the second we confidently feel like there's no longer a threat, and I'm just doing what I feel like is the safe choice here." Making that kind of decision, and then backing it up with "pfuh all those retards who disagree" comments, I mean come the fuck on man.

And even then I think there's an argument to be had about banning some groups rather than flat out all Muslims. That being said, it's an undeniably effective way to combat terrorism.

[Rayfist]

I really have a distaste for the social justice type movement at this point, their whole agenda feels incredible self-serving and like it's turning politics into something fashionable with labels to show off.

What's really fucking sad though is how much these social justice people ASSISTED in helping Trump get elected. A lot of people voted for Trump out of protest, not such a smart idea, I know, but that's what happened. People get VERY fed up with being labeled 'racists, misogynists, etc.' and considering we have a lot of young adult voters in pretty sj infested campuses, it's no surprise that people got this easily ticked by it. I truly do think Clinton would have had a much stronger chance of winning had a lot of that not happened. I've seen a lot of people who disagree with Trump's stance on just about almost everything, but are so mad at the current state of social justice that they WANTED to vote for Trump. Again, I don't think this is a smart idea since it's not really concerning the country at hand, but that's what it does. Of course you have your stereotypical Trump voters, but I feel like they ended up being the butt of all jokes that a lot of the silent majority of people got super fed up with it. Almost nobody in this generation wants to be labeled as such. A huge majority of this generation were borderline bullied into voting for him. Bare in mind I think both the right and left both have their equally as bad people.

Now I'm not a Trump voter, I wasn't for him personally, but even in this case, I can see why people wanted things to be this way. It's not the future I wanted, but I'm willing to stick through it these next four years, and hope that it doesn't hit my Dad hard. Keep in mind I'm not trying to be pro Trump or Hillary here, only stating that I can easily see why this outcome happened due to the social justice community, the very thing they tried to avoid happening, happened. The amount of self awareness is truly astounding. Hell, I'm even seeing third party voters being attacked for this, which definitely wasn't the case before.

[Keane]

Yeah it's fucking gay as hell, they're just causing more division. I never get why everyone treats it like this "us vs. them" scenario, and go out of their way to try and dehumanise and shame the opposite side as much as possible. We're all just voting for what we think is the right direction, and smugly, condescendingly declaring each other the black to your white isn't going to help. If anything it surprises me how strikingly similar many of the Trump base's ideals are to my own, even though I oppose about 90% of their agenda.

In fact, I think it contributed even more significantly to the split of the Sanders and Clinton base than it did liberal vs. conservative: You had all these Clinton supporters like Bill Maher coming out going "Get in line, it's her or Trump. We need party unity, retard." And then they all freaked out in shock that Sanders supporters were looking into third parties or some even contemplating Trump. Your candidate insulted real progressive ideals and worked behind the scenes with the DNC, maybe you should've thought about trying to court the people you've disavowed instead of smugly assuming you've got them locked down.

[Itooh]

I agree with most of those points. This remind me of a very great article by the Intercept, about how we learn nothing from Brexit (and probably even before).
Finally this is just a side effect of a failure that happened a while ago. And a terrible candidate like Hillary had barely no chances to change anything.

[Dart]

What I find to be a complete joke is that people who were well-aware of the fact they're both absolutely terrible candidates have become so utterly devastated over Trump winning - and yes, this goes for a number of people from RPC as well, especially when all they can think of at this point are "the rights of women, Muslims, LGBT people and so on", but I'll get back to that - get your shit straight you agonisingly self-absorbed retards. I have sympathy for those directly affected by any of the negative policies he'll actually end up enforcing, but the alternative is living in fear for the safety of the world itself. The last thing the country needs right now is a corrupt, slimy, war-bent politician in office. Just like with Brexit, all I hear people complaining about is how the this will affect them in the most immediate, trivial fashion ("My college/studies funding is going to be dropped, higher shipping taxes, my religion is looked down upon!!"); I'm not American or British, but if I were, I would not have the gall to lie to myself like that.

Ye quite frankly people are just dumb. They act like this is suddenly the end of America and forget that this place is a democracy where if the government doesn't listen to the people enough, it gets kicked to the curb. literally the only people that need to be concerned are the retarded SJWs that have taken shit waaay to far, and ironically memed Trump into office.

Yeah it's fucking gay as hell, they're just causing more division. I never get why everyone treats it like this "us vs. them" scenario, and go out of their way to try and dehumanise and shame the opposite side as much as possible. We're all just voting for what we think is the right direction, and smugly, condescendingly declaring each other the black to your white isn't going to help. If anything it surprises me how strikingly similar many of the Trump base's ideals are to my own, even though I oppose about 90% of their agenda.

In fact, I think it contributed even more significantly to the split of the Sanders and Clinton base than it did liberal vs. conservative: You had all these Clinton supporters like Bill Maher coming out going "Get in line, it's her or Trump. We need party unity, retard." And then they all freaked out in shock that Sanders supporters were looking into third parties or some even contemplating Trump. Your candidate insulted real progressive ideals and worked behind the scenes with the DNC, maybe you should've thought about trying to court the people you've disavowed instead of smugly assuming you've got them locked down.

What I think most people forget in politics is that we are still on the same team, we just have different viewpoints on how to manage it and that no one way is the right way. Most people also don't get that being "left" means that the government should do more work and that "right" means the government should do less. Being left doesn't mean that you have to be some collectivist furfag that moans about the patriarchy (insert Chris Ray Gun joke here*) and being right doesn't make you racist; and I would know this because I would say I personally lean toward libertarian ideals which measures on the right.

One last thing I really want to add. I am severely disgusted how with how the media and celebrities have reacted to this shit. Like yes it ain't the best think in the world, but swallow your pride for at least a moment ya assholes. The world ain't ending, the peoples rights ain't leaving just cause our main nigga Obama's leaving next year. Women, LGBT, Minority Races, having NOTHING to worry about. I'll for sure no longer be supporting many of these assholes in the future.

Also the nigga-elect Trump ain't as big a bigot and racist as people think, for proof here's him getting an award with Muhammad Ali and fucking ROSA PARKS!

[Pirez]

Also the nigga-elect Trump ain't as big a bigot and racist as people think, for proof here's him getting an award with Muhammad Ali and fucking ROSA PARKS!

Is that Victor Borge with the mustache?

[Dart]

apparently yeah, they're all receiving the Ellis Island award.

[Pirez]

The dude's my idol. The comedian with the most talent ever.

Also, and although I don't say it's the case for this photo (since Trump also has a medal around his neck), I don't think saying "the dude took a picture with a famous black right activist, therefore he isn't racist" is fair. A few years back in France, we had Dieudonné taking pictures with celebrities doing his trademark "anti-system gesture", which the celebrities weren't aware of. Once Dieudonné's scheme was revealed to the public, the celebrities realized they were framed.

Point is, this could happen to anybody. But again, I'm not saying it's the case for this picture. It's just a counter-case for this argument in general.

[Rayfist]

I think Trump is very mixed in terms of LGBT. Recently he's made a statement saying he'd protect them, but then I've been hearing about him signing anti LGBT stuff, so it's super confusing.

Regardless, I really would not reach the conclusion that he is against LGBT, at all. Though, Pence does seem like something to understandably be legitimately worried about.

Edit: Oh how giddy, not too long after Trump winning and people are already spewing straight up lies

[Hunchman801]

We have? I don't remember talking about him, but maybe I forgot.

I don't think it was with you, that's probably why.

What I think most people forget in politics is that we are still on the same team, we just have different viewpoints on how to manage it and that no one way is the right way. Most people also don't get that being "left" means that the government should do more work and that "right" means the government should do less. Being left doesn't mean that you have to be some collectivist furfag that moans about the patriarchy (insert Chris Ray Gun joke here*) and being right doesn't make you racist; and I would know this because I would say I personally lean toward libertarian ideals which measures on the right.

It's a tad more complex than that: right-wing politics are a combination of economic liberalism and conservatism, while left-wing politics favor regulatory economics and social progressism. What you meant is probably that people don't have to be on the right-left axis, and can hold various positions on the political compass.

Also, I've seen quite a few rants here regarding extremist social justice activism, and this article, Liberals and the Illiberal Left, is an absolutely brilliant analysis on the subject.

When Democrats don't stand up to the policing of speech, they surrender control of their party to its most extreme elements.

It explains how those well-known, extremely intolerant far-left movements that flourish on social networks have become so prominent and, unsurprisingly, caused a lot of harm to moderate liberal ideas.

[Master]

The Snooper's Charter just got passed here in the UK.

[PluMGMK]

I'll just go add that to my list of reasons to die.

[Acarr]

First the toblerones and now this...

[Adsolution]

Wait, that wasn't a law in the UK already? You guys have been getting off lucky for the last who knows how long.

[Master]

We've had snooping already, but I believe this expands it legally.

[Hunchman801]

The Snooper's Charter just got passed here in the UK.

Time to go full-on VPN guys.

[incognito]

You guys are so fucked.... Lol.