Off Topic

[Fifo]

Would you guys be willing to fill out a short survey?
-cut-

Thanks.

[Steo]

I heard that Notre Dame in Paris caught fire the other day, apparently there are plans to rebuild it and design a new spire for it because the other one collapsed during the blaze.

[Fifo]

Just trying to draw attention to a thread…

--link stripped--

[Reese Riverson]

I heard that Notre Dame in Paris caught fire the other day, apparently there are plans to rebuild it and design a new spire for it because the other one collapsed during the blaze.

Yeah I've heard the news, this is quite unfortunate. I wonder if they've found the cause of it yet?

[Steo]

It really is rather unfortunate. People think it was an electrical fire caused by a short circuit at the moment.

[The Jonster]

I heard about it very briefly on the radio show I listen to, but that’s very tragic.

Just trying to draw attention to a thread…

viewtopic.php?t=27451

May I ask what’s your opinion on this fire if you don’t mind?

[Fifo]

May I ask what’s your opinion on this fire if you don’t mind?

Ouch. I feel sorry for all those people who died/suffered consequences.

[R4Y_ANC3L]

Usually things involving electricity are the causes of many fire incidents. And it is mainly because they are being misused.

[Reese Riverson]

Ouch. I feel sorry for all those people who died/suffered consequences.

Um, Fifo? No one died, let alone were injured from this. At least based off what reports I last saw.

[Fifo]

Ouch. I feel sorry for all those people who died/suffered consequences.

Um, Fifo? No one died, let alone were injured from this. At least based off what reports I last saw.

Ah, you seem to be right – Google confirms it. Stupid me

[The Jonster]

I knew it. Jesus, FIfo if you're going to sound sympathetic, you should at least do your research BEFORE responding. And it's not very nice to draw attention away from such a major event such as the Notre Dame fire with quizzes, just so you know.

It really is rather unfortunate. People think it was an electrical fire caused by a short circuit at the moment.

Yeah most reports I'm reading say it was probably a short circuit, with at least one adding that a computer glitch also may have contributed to it.

[Aaron]

Well, yeah, trying to draw attention to your thread is not nice when there's a lot more problematic and major event like the Notre Dame fire breaking out.

A computer glitch? A computer glitch could cause a fire? I always knew that computer glitches weren't nice, but I didn't know they could do even worse things.

The only thing that I deplore about this event is how the Notre Dame looks so beautiful and it's very tall, meaning it would take years (20 years!) to reconstruct it. I know it will probably be fine in the next 20 years and it's gonna stand there the same way, though it still survived so many years. Over 800 years since it was built in the 12th century.

[Steo]

Apparently they're saying it was a small fire in the roof at first, but it was hard to get to and ended up spreading. It also turns out a firefighter and 2 police officers were injured according to the latest news update. They're having a fundraiser to try get the money together to rebuild the roof and spire.

[Reese Riverson]

A computer glitch? What’d they use a computer for?

Either way, we know how old the entire building is, I’d imagine the electrical wiring is quite old too. Though fortunately there were only three injuries, considering the severity of the situation.

Hopefully they’ll get things restored without any trouble, but I’d imagine it’s going to be expensive. So hopefully the fundraiser will help tremendously.

Just imagine how much it cost to build the place to begin with, nearly 900 years ago. With a lot of fire and likely water damage it’ll take a lot to make the place structurally sound again. Then to try to match the craftsmanship it had been built with will certainly be time consuming, but certainly worth it once they get it completed.

If this was a bad electrical issue too (like old wiring), I hope they also plan to re-wire the place to help prevent this from happening again.

[The Jonster]

I have no idea tbh, I was searching the web to find out why it happened and I saw this CBS article stating a computer glitch may also have been a cause along with the electrical short circuit. (I'll list it below)

https://www.cbsnews.com/live-news/notre ... e-updates/

Also, I might as well bring this up, but due to the fire, Ubisoft is giving away Assassin's Creed Unity for free.

https://store.ubi.com/us/assassins-cree ... lang=en_US

[Steo]

I guess that's pretty cool, I'll download it. Anyway, the fundraiser has earned €1,000,000,000 so far, that's definitely going to go a long way during the rebuilding of the cathedral.

As for the cause, old wiring sounds most likely to be the culprit, I can't really think of anything else that would start a fire in the roof.

[PluMGMK]

So the glitch prevented them from finding the fire quickly enough. That makes more sense.

Anyway, a cigarette butt could potentially be another cause, if people are sloppy, but I feel better believing it was a short circuit.

[Reese Riverson]

So the glitch prevented them from finding the fire quickly enough. That makes more sense.

Anyway, a cigarette butt could potentially be another cause, if people are sloppy, but I feel better believing it was a short circuit.

Well it's not out of the question that could be a cause too still, considering there was already a form of renovation going on there.

The only thing I can think of a use of a computer, at least in a place like old and huge, was an attempt to handle some building automation. Such as lighting control.

However, a computer isn't technically glitching when it does exactly what it was programmed to do, say turn light A on or turn on exhaust fan C... Like if there was a short circuit, or some old (or new can happen too) wiring got damaged during renovation work... or an old piece of air circulation equipment had an issue then it could be a failed safety circuit like a fuse or circuit breaker. Which a computer wouldn't be aware of in most cases, unless there is some sort of advanced feedback system installed.

Though another possibility that isn't uncommon is someone bypassing safety measures, like replacing a fuse with a metal bolt, or hooking the electrical up direct.

One of the family friends we have used to do heat and air work, and one of the installs he did was at a church. Well, the furnaces were not running yet since the gas was still turned off, but yet somehow that church ended up burning to the ground shortly after. It turned out from investigations, the cause was due to someone outright bypassing a fuse within a circuit box that fed the emergency exit signs... the wire ran alll the way up to the steeple and then throughout the facility to feed every single exit sign. One of those ended up shorting out and with zero protection you had the full 200 amp services going into that 12AWG or 14AWG cable melting it down and thus causing a fire.


It's rather unfortunate, but many people tend to forget or don't simply care about the safeties put in place. With a place as old as that Cathedral, especially with as huge as it was, who's to honestly say when it first had electricity installed, when or if it was ever upgraded to any partial or full extent, and how well it was maintained. Some maintenance people could easily have helped cause greater wear and tear on an electrical system of any age, like the incident mentioned above.

Maybe they'll determine the exact cause of the fire in this case for the Cathedral, because I'm sure it could be a lengthy investigation still if they are not 100% certain yet still.

It's just coming from our line of business and experiences from the folks I know of that seen such things done, too many people do things that just aren't safe. Plus there's still always the result of failed equipment causing the issue, but sometimes that can be made worse if safeties were removed from the equation.

[Steo]

Though another possibility that isn't uncommon is someone bypassing safety measures, like replacing a fuse with a metal bolt, or hooking the electrical up direct.

I can vouch for this also, there's too many cowboy electricians out there that are actually qualified, yet they refuse to do their job right and cut corners. There was a house that had the breakers bypassed and the woman had to go 2 days with no power when the electrician found out, he said it's too dangerous to leave it like that and they'd have to rewire it all.

Another one was a woman that wanted a new electric cooker, the guy came out and had a look, then said "I've to go get a switch for that, I'll be back later on". He never came back and the woman was wondering why. After a few days she got another electrician out and told him the story, he said "ah I see why he ran, your cooker is hooked up to your shower".

Those electric showers have 2 heating elements and can draw anywhere around 8-10.5kW depending on the model, that's a lot of power, and it goes without saying that a cooker uses a fair amount of power too. Those RCBO's (if they even used one of those) for the shower are usually rated about 40A, an 8.5kW shower (I'm almost sure that's what ours is) will draw around 37A alone, that would leave only 3A of headroom before it's technically overloading the breaker which clearly won't be even nearly enough to power a cooker, especially if it has an electric hob too. A hob would draw about 5kW and an oven about 3kW. Wires and breakers really heat up when such a high current is drawn and with 2 really high powered devices are running off a single breaker like that, it really is a massive fire hazard.

Those showers actually draw so much current that only one is allowed to be on in a house at a time. If a house plans to have 2, they need to use a special breaker that switches the power off to the second one as long as one is running. Basically if that cooker had a hob with all 4 burners running and the oven on too, that's like powering 2 showers off a single breaker, never mind a single house. If that cooker and shower had been running at the same time then she was really blessed that the house never went up in flames. That electrician that ran off the first time really is an asshole for not saying anything and leaving it that way also.

[Fifo]

I know y’all are gonna just screw me based on past experiences but…

Is there a person who would be willing to re-record a MIDI piano part with a proper MIDI keyboard for me?
I want a “human” feel to it because the original MIDI sounds too artificial and I don’t have MIDI equipment myself.

Thanks in advance for your willingness to help!