Dark Rayman & Bad Rayman

[foultzboyz]

He is technically an alternate skin, though he also has alternate personality. He's dark, evil, and in this case similar to Globox vs. Dark Globox. It appears as a skin, though it's very much implied that he's still his own self, which is what gets me in those terms. Really, I think Dark was just grouped with Rayman for the reason that they use the same 3D model and everything while Globox and Dark Globox use pretty different models and animations.

[Hunchman801]

He's a skin of Rayman, but when you select him the name "Dark Rayman" appears in the menu instead of "Rayman".

He is technically an alternate skin, though he also has alternate personality. He's dark, evil, and in this case similar to Globox vs. Dark Globox. It appears as a skin, though it's very much implied that he's still his own self, which is what gets me in those terms. Really, I think Dark was just grouped with Rayman for the reason that they use the same 3D model and everything while Globox and Dark Globox use pretty different models and animations.

This is why he deserves a whole article, unlike other skins.

[El Dango]

A Strawberry Globox article would be cool though.

[Hunchman801]

I have just reorganised and rewritten the Bad Rayman article. I may add one or two pictures from the original game and Rayman Junior, but well, the most important was done. I've tried to clear up the confusion with Dark Rayman, and to give less importance to the GBC version (the whole article almost sounded like it was his only appearance). Feel free to give your opinion!
By the way, I'm almost finished with the Rayman 1 RayWiki project, which means that almost everything in the original game now has an article on RayWiki. I'm not sure which game I'll work on next though.

[Cairnie]

We'll need some incredible work done on everything about Rayman 2, like screens and stuff, so maybe we could start on that. Perhaps we can get Spiraldoor to take screens of the Dreamcast-only stuff if he could make it that far.

[Hunchman801]

An incredible work has already been done about the original game, so I ain't scared However, I may work a bit on Rayman Junior before I move to Rayman 2. As concerns spiral, I count on him There are many different versions of Rayman 2, and we will need help from several people to capitalise all this knowledge.

[foultzboyz]

Sorry guys that I haven't been around much, though I've been held up tremendously by working and personal stuff like the Make Something Unreal Contest, Phase 3 which ends on Friday (I'm entering!) and Phase 4 at the end of the summer, and at the end of my vacation, so I won't be catching a break for a while. I'd go with Rayman 2 though--it's not only next in line though it was probably the most popular and the most critically-acclaimed. (Critics liked them all though Rayman 2 got some particularly superb marks.) I'll get back into it when I can, hopefully soon.

[DigitheCrystalgem]

Most people seem to think that Dark Rayman and Bad Rayman aren't the same, but really, I don't see why this is. First of all, why would Rayman have two different evil clones? It just seems a really weird choice for the developers to make. Does that mean that there'd be a Dark Bad Rayman as well? And don't tell me that one's name is "Bad Rayman" and the other's is "Dark Rayman", because in Rayman Junior, the evil clone who follows you is referred to as the "Wicked Double" repeatedly by Betilla. And don't tell me that Bad Rayman is dead and Dark Rayman is another character, because in Rayman Junior and Rayman Designer he can die and be re-summoned repeatedly by Mister Dark. And look at the them:





They have similar colours, glowing eyes and the biggest difference is the clothes he's wearing. Judging by the colours, Bad Rayman is darker than Dark Rayman. And in Rayman Advance, at the start of Mr Dark's Dare part 2 it actually says "Beware of Dark Rayman", and I mean how much more specific can you get?

I know, he behaves differently in Arena...but so do all the other characters! And I'm trying to think of why Rayman would have multiple different evil clones, but I just can't. Does anyone else share my opinions?

The first could have died or was killed and deemed a failure by Mr.Dark.

[PluMGMK]

Not sure if it's been brought up before, but either way it's probably worth noting on this thread: the developers of Rayman 1 originally referred to the evil clone as "Black Rayman", as evidenced by the function names doBlackRaymanCommand and DoBlKRayRaymanCollision found in the Rayman Classic binary, and the event codename MS_dark_to_blackray in Rayman Designer's EVE.MLT. I guess it was obvious even then that this would be problematic as an official name, so the people who did the localization strings for Rayman Designer must have changed "Black" to "Bad", which retained the same initials and overall sound. Then I guess the people who added the "beware" line to Rayman Advance solved the problem a different way, by using Mister Dark's name.
(Incidentally, the localization strings for Rayman Designer also changed most "Blacktoon"s to "Antitoon", but if I recall correctly, they missed one… )

On another note, I've definitely said this before, but I may as well note it here: I'm fairly convinced that the whole Bad Rayman / Raymésis / Dark Rayman / Shadow Ray progression of the UbiArt games is a direct reference to this thread! After all, we know they read RayWiki, and this thread has been cited on RayWiki since 2009! What better way to troll bemuse a fandom that has pondered such questions as

than to create a litany of new evil clones whose roles are in constant flux from game to game? Thank you Ubisoft!

[Droolie]

Not sure if it's been brought up before, but either way it's probably worth noting on this thread: the developers of Rayman 1 originally referred to the evil clone as "Black Rayman", as evidenced by the function names doBlackRaymanCommand and DoBlKRayRaymanCollision found in the Rayman Classic binary, and the event codename MS_dark_to_blackray in Rayman Designer's EVE.MLT. I guess it was obvious even then that this would be problematic as an official name, so the people who did the localization strings for Rayman Designer must have changed "Black" to "Bad", which retained the same initials and overall sound. Then I guess the people who added the "beware" line to Rayman Advance solved the problem a different way, by using Mister Dark's name.
(Incidentally, the localization strings for Rayman Designer also changed most "Blacktoon"s to "Antitoon", but if I recall correctly, they missed one… )

This whole thing with Blacktoons and Black Rayman is simply because Mr Dark was called Mr Black at some point. This name can still be found in some leaked Rayman 1 Jaguar sound source files, probably elsewhere too:

Considering this, the UbiArt change to Dark Rayman and Darktoons, and the addition of new stuff like Darkroots makes it a lot more consistent with everything evil and dark blue having "dark" in its name - exactly like it was with "black" before the name changes for the original game!

[Hunchman801]

Black Rayman and Mr Black? That probably wouldn't have aged well. Anyway, it's certainly worth documenting on the wiki, along with the Blacktoons, of course.

[PluMGMK]

Interesting… Does that mean Krusty is one of the clowns in Candy Château, and he's his "bestest buddy in the whole world"?


I mean, it makes sense. Mister Dark's a lot blacker than Bad Rayman after all! It's strange though, by the time they were coding the cross-platform version, they'd clearly changed the Big Bad's name to "Dark", but kept "Black" Rayman and "Black"toons. This is clear from the juxtaposition in "MS_dark_to_blackray" Tbh it would have made more sense to do it the other way around, since (as shown above!) Mister Black is actually a real-life name, while "Dark Rayman" makes way more sense for a shadow clone

Also, among all this, we still have the filenames VIR.ETA and VIR.DES in Rayman Designer, which reflect an even earlier name for him, "Big Boss Virus"…
EDIT: And then we have BLK.ETA and BLK.DES for the Antitoons