Rayman 3 scores

[PluMGMK]

That's part 3 and Xenon used a glitch to thoroughly search that level and found no secrets.

[MrBadGuy]

What so I just did something wrong or is it always a low percentage?

EDIT-> Well, at least I got a smiley murphy face this time with 66911 ^^

[PluMGMK]

Well, I don't know much about scores so I don't know.

[MrBadGuy]

Alright, it was almost certainly my idiocy and I just missed loads of obvious gems or something

[Xenon]

It's the level where you need an uncharacteristically high score in order to achieve 100%. As Plum says, I'm almost certain there's no secret in this part, unless a green gem is dispensed from a rock or something... but I doubt that.

[MrBadGuy]

Ok, maybe I'll try again someday. Right now I'm just going to try and get a smiley face on TTOL lol.

[MandM81]

I think, it's important to say something.

@MandM: I never said that you are cheater, sfn said, that I said that. I said that time, that was standing at cheater's niveau for me, I meaned, that I did like you that time, like cheaters, but this is over. By the way, you are allowed to say, that I'm using mostwanteds trick, because I know better, because I don't use mostwanteds Trick. I said how my Extended Shoe-Combo is working, if you can't do it, you are just bad in playing the LS, but I'm too, cause this was just great luck. This Combo promises 43080, and for the rest 20 points, you have to ask me for them, then we can make a deal.

Now, eat this and beat this!

You just keep on going, huh!?

First of all, you did mention the word "cheater" and me in the same sentence on TSF. Since I have documented every single improvement since I had 830k points, that is a quite preposterous remark. You can't run away from that.

Secondly, you enter this forum to tell us that Xenon and I are not worthy of our positions in the HoF. You made up some rules, which all of a sudden made DTUCC and other German players top the list. You can do that on your own forum. By putting it out here, you insult the people on this forum. I have to remind you, that it is not the TSF that developed the game beyond 835k points. It was RZ and PC combined.

As for LS, well, I was inclined to believe your score in the beginning. Even though it was very unusual for a player with a score less than 800k points to make such an improvement, it could happen. And even though one very rarely is lucky in R3, it could happen. And it could happen that you just get ten shoe hits and a red gem, and get the Matuvu and enter the secret room successfully and on time. However unlikely your luck seemed to be, it could happen, and I could have believed you. But where you blew it, was when you subsequently claimed it was a piece of cake to get the maximum score in BOM, and you could get 43.700 points in LS and whatever you said at the time. Such improvements could only happen by using Mostwanted's method.

However, since I could believe your score in LS, why not make me sure of it by posting a screenshot of your score in LS? That way you can remove all doubt.

You are referring to The Extended Shoe Combo as your idea. It is not. I have used it before. And the cheater Nekrophil also described this shoe combo when he claimed to have scored 43.020 points in LS. It was posted on TSF, so you may have found it there.

I think I know my way around LS and the reason I haven't gotten the maximum score yet, is simply that I don't have the patience to race the shoe all day. But hey, maybe I can get lucky just you one day?

[DTUCC]

ah, well... let me join in here xD

Secondly, you enter this forum to tell us that Xenon and I are not worthy of our positions in the HoF. You made up some rules, which all of a sudden made DTUCC and other German players top the list.

i pretty much understand how cut thinks about all this. fairness is something which isn't distributed equally in this game. and i really do apreciate the idea of making fair calculations. i don't mean this in the way of making me 1st. i'm still far behind you, not only because of glitches and stuff. but i do belive it's 300 points which i just can't get in FC for the tribelle-combo. that still leaves an impressive lead, but those 300 points are A LOT. and i believe i'm going to get away even worse if you really improved the tribelle combo, or if you do some day.

there's like 300 points which PC players are behind console players because of DOTK and HH. probably there's even more stuff like that, i'm not sure about that right now. but we are about to push this game to it's limits. and that's what's going to make it necessary someday to pay attention to all this!

As for LS, well, I was inclined to believe your score in the beginning. Even though it was very unusual for a player with a score less than 800k points to make such an improvement, it could happen. And even though one very rarely is lucky in R3, it could happen. And it could happen that you just get ten shoe hits and a red gem, and get the Matuvu and enter the secret room successfully and on time. However unlikely your luck seemed to be, it could happen, and I could have believed you. But where you blew it, was when you subsequently claimed it was a piece of cake to get the maximum score in BOM, and you could get 43.700 points in LS and whatever you said at the time. Such improvements could only happen by using Mostwanted's method.

However, since I could believe your score in LS, why not make me sure of it by posting a screenshot of your score in LS? That way you can remove all doubt.

cut posted a screenshot of his score some days ago on TSF. as it is his score, i'm not going to post his screenshot here, but i believe as soon as he reads this he will be happy to share it with you. i'm not lying for him there. there is a screenshot in existence.

[MandM81]

I was probably a little bit too fast about removing all doubt. If he used Mostwanted's method, the screenshot will actually prove very little.

But nevertheless, as I said, I could believe his score in LS however unlikely it appears. His behaviour afterwards just pointed in another direction. So instead of being a cheater, he's just full of bullsh*t. The rules he set up for the game was, that it was far more difficult to play combos made by other players than playing one's own combos. Thus, since I made all combos by myself, I was a lesser player on that account. And players using my combos were actually better players because they were not their own. If that is not a sick and twisted rule, I don't know what is. And to insist on promoting it on this forum is downright stupid.

The game plays differently on various platforms. The Lums bug is of course one of those things. Another example is the Heckler in HH part 2 room 1. Some can take it in combo for 2.500 points, while some can't. Jona could do it on one computer and not on another one. I'm sure the Matuvus in combo are different too, some are easier on some platforms, some are more difficult. The Razoff glitch in BOM part 5 works out differently as well. My favourite complaint is that the Hoodblaster in BOM part 3 only survives once every hour, making this part horribly hard for me. I don't know how to single out all those differences and make a fair game for all.

[Xenon]

I guess, it's fair enough to make such judgements if you have enough skill in the field to criticise, but Cut just doesn't. I admit that I, creatively speaking, don't deserve third position as I haven't devised many combos (but that's mainly down to my late start). But it's in no right that Cut should claim that I don't deserve my place without giving any explanation. That's just judgemental and narrow-minded, coming from someone who is a far inferior player.

I probably don't dislike Cut as much as most people who post here do, yet I do think some of the things he has said here and in TSF are arrogant, half-baked and ignorant.

About this TLS business, I don't know much about it but I know it's possible to make vast improvements in short periods of time (as I myself have done this). If Cut were to provide screenshots or proper discussion about the way he plays his claims would be far more plausible. I'm not sure what to believe right now and I don't really want to pass judgement, but all I'll say is that his playing style looks peculiar.

[sfn42]

The quality of a player has nothing to do with the combos he devised. Some of us didn't have a real chance to add to the progress of the game because most things were already known when we started playing at the top level. That doesn't make us better or lesser players, however. The one and only criterion for the quality of a honest player is the HoF and everyone who says differently is just wrong in my opinion.

@MandM: TSF did a play a role in developing R3 to the current level. I think you don't understand it because you don't know TSF very well but one look at the TOP6 of the HoF should give you some clues. BTW, Cut's remarks on TSF were also insulting to the players there. He spread even more shit about the oh-so-easy Razoff-glitch and stuff, showing no respect to anyone else.

[Haruka]

Another score update (Thanks Xenon and AjaX):

TFC - 28749
CF - 70808
TBOM - 42009
TLOTLD - 93152
TDOTK - 66783
TLS - 40597
TSBTC - 40164
HH - 55244
TTOTL - 61871

I always wondered why the heck I always had before 61% on score level of the final part of TLS.

[sfn42]

Your score is progressing nicely. You have no glaring holes in any levels now but you could try to improve HH. Getting a score of about 65000-70000 there is not very difficult and it's always a fun level to play.

[Xenon]

I would suggest playing TDOTK as it's probably easier than HH... both are immensely fun to play though. In TDOTK if you learn the green gem combo in part 7 and the green gem combo in part 8 (which are both fairly easy combos that yield huge amounts of points), you'd be in for a nice level score. The remaining combos in TDOTK are simple and quite invaluable for points, so you shouldn't have too much trouble there. Good luck whatever you decide to do.

The quality of a player has nothing to do with the combos he devised. Some of us didn't have a real chance to add to the progress of the game because most things were already known when we started playing at the top level. That doesn't make us better or lesser players, however. The one and only criterion for the quality of a honest player is the HoF and everyone who says differently is just wrong in my opinion.

I do agree with most of this, but I think creativity is a valued factor too. Just happens that quite a few players nowadays can't show off their creativity in the game because past players have already done so, so it's kind of invalid. But in shadow, it's quite an important strand, I think.

[Haruka]

Your score is progressing nicely. You have no glaring holes in any levels now but you could try to improve HH. Getting a score of about 65000-70000 there is not very difficult and it's always a fun level to play.

Before watching your post I've played HH XD, updated score again.

TFC - 28749
CF - 70808
TBOM - 42009
TLOTLD - 93152
TDOTK - 66783
TLS - 40597
TSBTC - 40164
HH - 63455
TTOTL - 61871

I would suggest playing TDOTK as it's probably easier than HH... both are immensely fun to play though. In TDOTK if you learn the green gem combo in part 7 and the green gem combo in part 8 (which are both fairly easy combos that yield huge amounts of points), you'd be in for a nice level score. The remaining combos in TDOTK are simple and quite invaluable for points, so you shouldn't have too much trouble there. Good luck whatever you decide to do.

I'll give a try on that level next.

[sfn42]

I do agree with most of this, but I think creativity is a valued factor too. Just happens that quite a few players nowadays can't show off their creativity in the game because past players have already done so, so it's kind of invalid. But in shadow, it's quite an important strand, I think.

I used to think the same but I changed my mind. Just imagine there was no Jona. Who would have created most of the major combos? Or if there was no MandM. Who would have found ways to get past 850000? It could have been everyone, you, me, Haruka, Hunch or god-knows-who. Jona and MandM both had the right timing. Jona was the very first one to play the game very seriously and MandM was the first one to take the game to a new level. But that doesn't mean they are the only ones capable of these feats. Many are, all the others just didn't have a chance for various reasons, that doesn't make them lesser players.

BTW, I am not the biggest fan of DOTK. Sure, the level is easy and getting close to the maximum doesn't require much. However, the level is deadly boring, especially parts 1-5. One has to walk long distances without anything happening and the combos are way too simple to be fun. The only enjoyable parts of DOTK are 6 and 7 in my opinion.

[Haruka]

Other score update:

TFC - 28749
CF - 70808
TBOM - 42009
TLOTLD - 93152
TDOTK - 71845
TLS - 40597
TSBTC - 45689
HH - 63455
TTOTL - 61871

[MandM81]

I used to think the same but I changed my mind. Just imagine there was no Jona. Who would have created most of the major combos? Or if there was no MandM. Who would have found ways to get past 850000? It could have been everyone, you, me, Haruka, Hunch or god-knows-who. Jona and MandM both had the right timing. Jona was the very first one to play the game very seriously and MandM was the first one to take the game to a new level. But that doesn't mean they are the only ones capable of these feats. Many are, all the others just didn't have a chance for various reasons, that doesn't make them lesser players.

I hope I haven't given any wrong impression about creativity and lesser players. My only objection was, that Cut reversed everything and stated that it was better to play combos made by others than to create one's own combos. And with that ad hoc rule he entered this forum and claimed Xenon and I weren't worthy of our positions in the HoF. He doesn't really win any friends by claiming that.

I don't understand why players didn't have a chance to show their creativity and make new combos? There has been enough time the past few years to do that.

You're right I don't know much about TSF, however, I do know the major improvements in CF, DOTK, LS and SBTC all were revealed on RZ or PC. I was just making a point regarding Cut.

I completely agree with your remark on how to judge players, namely by looking at HoF. But without players with creativity and ideas, the game would have been dead long ago, wouldn't it?

[DTUCC]

not even 24 hours of absence and you guys give me a lot to read... and to think about...

first, haruka, because you maybe don't want to read everything I'm going to say xD
I'd say it's time to play TOTL or probably FC for 30.000. however, I was always horrble at making such suggestions as I pretty much followed my own order... xD

I was probably a little bit too fast about removing all doubt. If he used Mostwanted's method, the screenshot will actually prove very little.

that's exactly how i think about this. just as xenon says, i'm not sure what to belive right now. i know cut from the very beginning and i remember him as an honest player. i don't think he'd ever use any cheap tricks to increase his score. that's how i feel about him.

The game plays differently on various platforms. The Lums bug is of course one of those things. Another example is the Heckler in HH part 2 room 1. Some can take it in combo for 2.500 points, while some can't. Jona could do it on one computer and not on another one. I'm sure the Matuvus in combo are different too, some are easier on some platforms, some are more difficult. The Razoff glitch in BOM part 5 works out differently as well. My favourite complaint is that the Hoodblaster in BOM part 3 only survives once every hour, making this part horribly hard for me. I don't know how to single out all those differences and make a fair game for all.

my main complaint about this are the maximum scores. i'm not sure about this different-computer-thingy so i won't say anything about that. but in fact, there's 109.009 possible in HH for PC players. and there's 109.209 possible for all the console players. there's more of those examples which can easily be calculated. and that's what i'm just not happy with. some are able to get more points and other's arent. what if I had only 100 points more than mostwanted now? i'd be in a higher position as he is. and it's because of 200 points he can't get. and i'm not sure if i saw myself in front of him in that case...

The quality of a player has nothing to do with the combos he devised. Some of us didn't have a real chance to add to the progress of the game because most things were already known when we started playing at the top level. That doesn't make us better or lesser players, however. The one and only criterion for the quality of a honest player is the HoF and everyone who says differently is just wrong in my opinion.

i agree with this, except for everything i said already. i don't feel like being 200 points ahead of PC players in HH. i don't feel like being ahead of PC players in DOTK. and i don't feel like being 300 points behind in FC. the HoF says a lot, but not everything.

I used to think the same but I changed my mind. Just imagine there was no Jona. Who would have created most of the major combos? Or if there was no MandM. Who would have found ways to get past 850000? It could have been everyone, you, me, Haruka, Hunch or god-knows-who. Jona and MandM both had the right timing. Jona was the very first one to play the game very seriously and MandM was the first one to take the game to a new level. But that doesn't mean they are the only ones capable of these feats. Many are, all the others just didn't have a chance for various reasons, that doesn't make them lesser players.

it could have been everyone, but it couldn't have been anyone as well. i'm not quite sure about that. see, those things like the launching glitch in part 3 of SBTC, MandM81's jump in part 2 of CF, all the things like that. They may have not been found. no one can say that. i agree with you that developing or not developing combos don't make any players lesser worthy of their place in HoF.

I hope I haven't given any wrong impression about creativity and lesser players. My only objection was, that Cut reversed everything and stated that it was better to play combos made by others than to create one's own combos.
[...]
I completely agree with your remark on how to judge players, namely by looking at HoF. But without players with creativity and ideas, the game would have been dead long ago, wouldn't it?

playing only other's combos would mean that now one is allowed to develop new ideas. playing like that would cause the game's progress to stop. i don't like the idea of judging players because of the combos they played.

by the way, Xenon's score again disappered from the HoF...

[Xenon]

I used to think the same but I changed my mind. Just imagine there was no Jona. Who would have created most of the major combos? Or if there was no MandM. Who would have found ways to get past 850000? It could have been everyone, you, me, Haruka, Hunch or god-knows-who. Jona and MandM both had the right timing. Jona was the very first one to play the game very seriously and MandM was the first one to take the game to a new level. But that doesn't mean they are the only ones capable of these feats. Many are, all the others just didn't have a chance for various reasons, that doesn't make them lesser players.

You make a good point. But think of it like this: player A finishes with 500k and starts writing solutions to the levels, and player B joins lacking in any creativity, follows the solution player A provided and finishes with a similar score (as at 500k it's pretty easy)... who would you consider the better player? It's important to point out that Cut's list was personal and he chose the 'best' players (ie not necessarily ones with the highest scores).

I'm definitely not defending Cut here though. The HoF is without doubt the best indicator; I'm just trying to find some basis to his ridiculous ordering.

i agree with this, except for everything i said already. i don't feel like being 200 points ahead of PC players in HH. i don't feel like being ahead of PC players in DOTK. and i don't feel like being 300 points behind in FC. the HoF says a lot, but not everything.

I wouldn't worry about it. It's luck for those who can get additional points, and luck plays a big part in scoring in this game - just think about the Razoff glitch. Besides, PC players have the advantage when playing part 3 TBOM, right?

by the way, Xenon's score again disappered from the HoF...

It's getting annoying now... I wonder what's causing it. It's certainly not a manual removal.