The final version of RayWiki is available!

Haruka · Post by **Haruka** » Thu Mar 06, 2014 12:38 am

I have been trying to take screenshots in R3 whatever I have got the chance to spend some time in taking good snapshots. For now I have been doing for the beginning of each level phase but are there things that are in big need for a screenshot? The Fairy Council building is an example (that I should take later too).

Master · Post by **Master** » Thu Mar 06, 2014 12:46 am

I think some screenshots for The Lums Quest would be good too.

Haruka · Post by **Haruka** » Thu Mar 06, 2014 12:49 am

The Lums quest? Can you be more specific?

Master · Post by **Master** » Thu Mar 06, 2014 12:52 am

The article in general is pretty bare: https://raymanpc.com/wiki/en/Lums_Quest
I think we could do with adding some screenshots, though I guess we ought to be careful not to expose any codes.

Haruka · Post by **Haruka** » Thu Mar 06, 2014 1:17 pm

Ah ok, you mean taking a screenshot to the Rayman 3 section. (I was thinking in the RaymanZone thing itself)

What it can be done is to ommit the first three groups of code.

Post by **Hunchman801** » Sat Mar 15, 2014 10:12 pm

Anybody got a nice high-res screenshot of the Land of the Livid Dead in Origins? It's definitely missing on the wiki.

Haruka · Post by **Haruka** » Sun Mar 16, 2014 1:30 pm

I've tried to look for one in my Rayman Origins picture folder and nothing, I'm sorry. I also presume you do want a 1080p screenshot, which my display does not allow.

Cairnie · Post by **Cairnie** » Sun Mar 16, 2014 1:45 pm

Well I wrote in the Help:Image that if your display can't go up to 1080 then you could try using a HDMI cable to hook up to a HD TV; whether that's useful for everybody I don't know but it certainly helped me out with the Legends screens I took.

Haruka · Post by **Haruka** » Sun Mar 16, 2014 2:14 pm

My bedroom TV is 720p so no deal either. ^^'

Post by **Hunchman801** » Sun Mar 16, 2014 2:27 pm

Yes, the highest resolution would be appreciated! Also needed are the fight against Big Mama and the introduction scene.

Master · Post by **Master** » Fri Apr 11, 2014 3:45 pm

Hmm, just a sort of announcement, I've been messing around with the Rayman 1 enemy nav box, and I've been able to make it far tidier and concise now, akin to the Wikipedia templates:

I think there'll be some existing Nav boxes that could probably do with a similar reworking, as well as potential new ones. The code for this one is:

Code: Select all

{| class="navbox mw-collapsible mw-collapsed" width="100%" style="margin: 0 auto 0 auto; padding: 0.2em; border-width: 2px; border-style: solid; border-color:#AA0000; background:#14190E"
|-
! align="center" style=background:#0F120B colspan=3 |Enemies from ''[[Rayman 1|Rayman]]''
|-
! align="center" style=background:#0F120B;width:100px colspan=2 |General enemies
|[[Antitoon]] • [[Hunter]] • [[Lightning eyes]]
|-
! align="center" style=background:#0F120B;width:100px colspan=2 |[[The Dream Forest]]
|[[Piranha]] • [[Livingstone]] • [[Small Livingstone]] • [[Tentacle-flower]] • [[Mosquito]] 
|-
! align="center" style=background:#0F120B;width:100px colspan=2 |[[Band Land]]
|[[Cymbals]] • [[Moth]] • [[Red monster]] • [[Trumpet]] • [[Walking drum]] (technical) • [[Wrong note]] 
|-
! align="center" style=background:#0F120B;width:100px colspan=2 |[[Blue Mountains]]
|[[Stone dog]] • [[Stone man]] • [[Stake]]
|-
! align="center" style=background:#0F120B;width:100px colspan=2 |[[Picture City]]
| [[Bomb pirate]] • [[Ring pirate]] • [[Space pirate]]
|-
! align="center" style=background:#0F120B;width:100px colspan=2 |[[The Caves of Skops]]
| [[Large-mouthed fish]] • [[Spider (Caves of Skops)|Spider]] • [[Stake]] • [[Stone dog]]
|-
! align="center" style=background:#0F120B;width:100px colspan=2 |[[Candy Château]]
| [[Bad Rayman]] • [[Big clown]] • [[Bomber clown]] • [[Water clown]]  
|}

Hmm, so, any thoughts? I think we can use the above template to merge the Rayman 1 worlds with the individual Rayman 1 level templates for instance.

spiraldoor · Post by **spiraldoor** » Fri Apr 11, 2014 9:05 pm

I spend a massive amount of time editing Wikipedia, and for some reason I have a particular fascination with navigational templates, so here's some notes. (I'm going to generalise a lot here because this advice applies to all of the wiki's navboxes, and because I don't really do RayWiki any more.)

I'm not saying we should copy Wikipedia's manual of style, but it's something they've developed over many years of arguments and resolutions and iterative improvements, and there's a lot we can take from it.

This is a massive improvement but could do with some refinement.

First, we need to find a way to align the headings to the left of the template, which will make it much more compact; you have them centred, which generates a lot of unsightly whitespace.

Each Wikipedia navbox includes in its header direct links to the template itself (V), the template's talk page (T), and the template's edit (E) page. This would make it enormously easier for users to contribute to the template. As it stands, they have to dig through the source code of a transcluded page and somehow figure out that they've got to run a search for the prefix "Template:" followed by the contents of the curly brackets at the bottom of the page... I'm amazed ANYONE ever edits them. I've messed with the code but I couldn't figure out how to link to an edit page or align these technical links to the left of the header.

Since alphabetical ordering adds zero navigational functionality, it'd be better to reorganise the enemies in the order in which they are first encountered.

I'd definitely add the game's bosses to the respective sections, since they're certainly enemies.

Another change I'd consider, which might be slightly more controversial, is to remove the links to the worlds. On Wikipedia at least, it's frowned upon for a navbox to link to articles which don't fall directly under its scope, since it's neater and just plain nicer for each navbox to be self-consistent and focused. Another possibility would be to actually include the navbox at the bottom of each world's article, but that could seem messy. It's a bit hazy whether the link to the original game should be included here... though I suppose the template is more relevant to the game than it is to the individual worlds though. You could just have the header text link to the category for Enemies from Rayman 1. (All the "...from Rayman X" categories should really be renamed "...in Rayman X", which would be more grammatically accurate (Globox isn't FROM Rayman 3, is he?) but I wouldn't waste time and energy on trivial stuff like this unless we had a bot that could handle it for us.

I was going to suggest creating a template for EVERY Rayman enemy rather than doing it by game, but now that I see how nice the world-based groups look I'm reconsidering that. Still something to consider. Now I think a template for Rayman 2 enemies and one for Rayman 3 enemies would be useful additions (much more so than the insane Robo-Pirates and Hoodlums templates!). Bear in mind, though, that it's perfectly acceptable for an article to be included in more than one template, assuming that it falls under various important navigational areas – for example, a template for all the bosses in the Rayman series (with one group/line for each game) would be really helpful; each boss could be in the overall bosses template but also in the enemies template for their respective game.

The Rayman 1 worlds and levels templates should ABSOLUTELY be merged. There's hardly any point in a template with only three or six articles, especially when six templates fall directly under the scope of another one!

Master · Post by **Master** » Fri Apr 11, 2014 9:52 pm

spiraldoor wrote:First, we need to find a way to align the headings to the left of the template, which will make it much more compact; you have them centred, which generates a lot of unsightly whitespace.

Hmm, shouldn't be too difficult, I'll mess around with it and see what I get.

spiraldoor wrote:Each Wikipedia navbox includes in its header direct links to the template itself (V), the template's talk page (T), and the template's edit (E) page. This would make it enormously easier for users to contribute to the template. As it stands, they have to dig through the source code of a transcluded page and somehow figure out that they've got to run a search for the prefix "Template:" followed by the contents of the curly brackets at the bottom of the page... I'm amazed ANYONE ever edits them. I've messed with the code but I couldn't figure out how to link to an edit page or align these technical links to the left of the header.

I gave that a shot myself after my first edit, but I didn't get anywhere either, I'm not even sure how to link to an edit page. Probably a job for a higher up, I guess.

spiraldoor wrote:Since alphabetical ordering adds zero navigational functionality, it'd be better to reorganise the enemies in the order in which they are first encountered.

Alright then, my memory is a little fuzzy when it comes to Rayman 1, but I shouldn't find it too difficult.

spiraldoor wrote:I'd definitely add the game's bosses to the respective sections, since they're certainly enemies.

True, I'll add them in then.

spiraldoor wrote:Another change I'd consider, which might be slightly more controversial, is to remove the links to the worlds. On Wikipedia at least, it's frowned upon for a navbox to link to articles which don't fall directly under its scope, since it's neater and just plain nicer for each navbox to be self-consistent and focused. Another possibility would be to actually include the navbox at the bottom of each world's article, but that could seem messy. It's a bit hazy whether the link to the original game should be included here... though I suppose the template is more relevant to the game than it is to the individual worlds though. You could just have the header text link to the category for Enemies from Rayman 1. (All the "...from Rayman X" categories should really be renamed "...in Rayman X", which would be more grammatically accurate (Globox isn't FROM Rayman 3, is he?) but I wouldn't waste time and energy on trivial stuff like this unless we had a bot that could handle it for us.

Hmm, I'm not really inclined towards any arrangement as is, I'll let the more better versed state what they will on this matter.

spiraldoor wrote:I was going to suggest creating a template for EVERY Rayman enemy rather than doing it by game, but now that I see how nice the world-based groups look I'm reconsidering that. Still something to consider. Now I think a template for Rayman 2 enemies and one for Rayman 3 enemies would be useful additions (much more so than the insane Robo-Pirates and Hoodlums templates!). Bear in mind, though, that it's perfectly acceptable for an article to be included in more than one template, assuming that it falls under various important navigational areas – for example, a template for all the bosses in the Rayman series (with one group/line for each game) would be really helpful; each boss could be in the overall bosses template but also in the enemies template for their respective game.

There are already pre-existing R2 and R3 templates I made earlier, I could retool them to include the Robo Pirates and Hoodlums, though given that there are some individual Hoodlum and Pirates which are exclusive to other titles, I'm not wholly sure of what we can do about the current Pirate and Hoodlum templates, I guess we could keep them both.

spiraldoor wrote:The Rayman 1 worlds and levels templates should ABSOLUTELY be merged. There's hardly any point in a template with only three or six articles, especially when six templates fall directly under the scope of another one!

Wholeheartedly agreed, I think the same goes for Origin's and Legend's templates as well.
----
Alright, I've tweaked the R1enemies template with those suggestions in mind, this is what I've got now: https://raymanpc.com/wiki/en/Template:R1enemies

Haruka · Post by **Haruka** » Fri Apr 11, 2014 11:32 pm

Those are really good suggestions over there, but I really don't know coding in a way that I could organize the templates in other way but they definitely need a revision to look less messy. I do like the one screenshoted by Master, that looks more organized and clean.

Master · Post by **Master** » Fri Apr 11, 2014 11:44 pm

To be honest, most of it was just taking what was already there, and making comparisons with other available examples, I was able to view the source of a template which employed a similar structure on the Mario Wiki, I then did a bit of tinkering with the R1enemies template I made a while back, and got the above.

Hmm, on the topic of the VTE links, perhaps this might be of some use: http://interi.org/2012/05/wikipedias-navbox-template/

spiraldoor · Post by **spiraldoor** » Sat Apr 12, 2014 12:12 am

I'm more used to dealing with instances of templates than modifying the underlying code too. Apparently Wikipedia's navbox template has a Lua component – hopefully it doesn't do anything too important! You've done good work on the navbox, keep tweaking.

I've noticed that most of the character navboxes seem to be collapsed by default nowadays, which is kind of obstructive. On Wikipedia, a navbox will generally open automatically if it's the only one on a page, but collapse if there are multiple ones – this is a good balance between accessibility and functionality I think. Can we implement that?

Is there a handy way to make all the text in a navbox (except the header) small? That's how they do it on Wikipedia, and it's nice and compact. We could use <small> in every cell, but that'd be really inefficient.

I'd forgotten about the Friends templates, like this one:

https://raymanpc.com/wiki/en/Template:R1characters

I'd recomment merging them with the enemy template for each world. I can certainly imagine most users wanting to jump back and forth between enemies and friendly characters, so it makes no sense to separate them. How about a comprehensive character navbox for each game? Just paste R1's seven non-hostile characters into the top row of the R1 enemies template and rename it. (Do we know how to do subgroups? This will be very important if we start consolidating templates.)

Some of the navboxes have rather garish colours – this works OK for the R1 characters template, since the colours really evoke the game, but for some (like the Origins enemies one) the colour scheme strains the eyes. It might be for the best to agree on a unified colour scheme for all navboxes. I'd suggest modelling them after the Rayman series one, which blends really well with the wiki's colours. It would also be a good idea to subtly differentiate the background colour of each group.

Master · Post by **Master** » Sat Apr 12, 2014 1:35 am

Hmm, I'll look into those things tomorrow morning then, there should be a way to do things like that.

However, I think it might be best if we were to fully implement the templates that Wikipedia uses, it'll make it much easier to make these sort of nav boxes. That's a job for a higher up though, from what I've read.

As for merging enemies with Characters, with this set-up, it's very much plausible, anyone else got any thoughts on the matter?

Master · Post by **Master** » Sat Apr 12, 2014 10:51 am

Ok, a double post with an update, I decided to look again at Super Mario Wiki's way of dealing with Nav boxes, I notice that they tend to have all aspects of a game under the same heading, meaning that one can easily navigate between worlds to enemies to bosses to main characters etc.

I've made out a draft version of a Rayman 1 template that follows this design, with sub-groups as well:

Feel free to tinker with it, you can find it on my To do list page: https://raymanpc.com/wiki/en/User:Maste ... ing_Navbox

Haruka · Post by **Haruka** » Sat Apr 12, 2014 12:04 pm

That's a good try, Master. I do prefer this kind of organization now.

Super Mario Wiki and Bulbapedia are some of the dedicated wikis that are good examples to check out by the way.

Master · Post by **Master** » Sat Apr 12, 2014 5:36 pm

I've been checking them out, though I've had to do a bit of guesswork and experimenting myself as I wasn't able to find examples for certain things. I've made a few further tweaks now, the rows alternate in colour, and the minigames are now added.

I'm not so sure about the creatures, plants and objects though, they need to be more accessible, but I wonder if they should have their own separate template. I think I want to try making a template for the powers and power-ups, lums and a more concise template for every Rayman game as well.

In addition, I've made a template that navigates to articles about (or failing that, directly to) the various affiliates and projects that RPC hosts or has ties with. Like I've said in other places, I feel we need to make our fellow projects more prominent, regardless of whereabouts the RPC we are, this template is a bit of a starting point by firmly tying all official RPC affiliates and projects together.

Finally, while I've not been here long, I've been trying to expand the article about RPC, I've been trying to find and archive the various themes and designs we've had over the last decade, so far, I've retrieved about six. I think we also need to do something about the Privacy Policy and Disclaimer pages, they're pretty bare, yet they're prominently featured at the bottom of every page on the Wiki.

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