Rayman Pirate-Community

I'm aiming for 8 pm!

I'm in as well!
Unfortunately I expect that I might get interrupted a few times, meaning I might miss something now and then, but I hope it won't be too bad.

Also, something I want to say already beforehand, since during the stream it'd take me far too long to write since I'm incapable of multitasking:

I played for shortly HH3 in order to test the RSJ on the box with the blue can, and surprisingly I found out that this glitch isn't so inconsistent as I thought. In fact, within the few minutes in which I investigated the glitch again, I had a success rate of approx. 1 out of 5. With some practice it could be maybe 1 out of 3, when you are in a rush maybe 1 out of 6 (of course that are just some vague estimations).
Now, considering that the rest of the combo seems to be comparatively easy, I think that this might be the best combo we'll find.
Of course, maybe it's possible to play a combo, where the outcome is even higher, but then I'm sure that the combo will be a lot harder than this one.

Btw., the reason why the RSJ became much more consistent, is that in my latest attemps I was rolling a little different than in the first ones: Firstly, as I wrote in my previous post, you have to roll in just a small angle towards the box; not completely parallel, but maybe in a ~5-10° angle, and secondly, you shouldn't try to walk off the box as far as possible and activate the snapshot mode in the last moment, but rather activate it already a little bit earlier. At least that's my (early) impression; yet I don't have too much experience with the RSJ.

tuned in for the last 5 minutes, not enough to make me grasp the full version of clearleaf forest, but at least of the first room amazing work you all! i'm kind of getting into the mood to play r3 again, although there's seemingly heaps to catch up on. gonna read through the thread now and see if i can somehow interfere with your plans to become world record holder. apparently, there are only 3 veterans left atm with maz, 1234 and cut, but keep that wonderful spirit going guys

Hey, if you like, we can hang out in a voice chat for the next stream to discuss these thing together

Also, just a quick heads up: 2380 points improvement in the 1st room of CF thanks to Maz' amazing idea! (28200 vs. 25820 before, excluding the yellow gems at the beginning)

Really, 2.380 Points? That's actually a lot more than I expected

Just one thing, I rewatched that part of the VOD and it seems like my messages couldn't be seen in chat, so here's a few suggestions:

1.) In the first room, why don't you kill the other Hoodlum on the upper floor first (the one without the $-sign)? In that case, you wouldn't have to use this weird approach where you break the Door mid-air and have to kill him afterwards; you could just kill him first, then jump across to the $-Hoodblaster and finish that one of and get the HMF.

2.) Related to 1.), if that works, you can easily include one of the Yellow Gems behind the door into the Combo. It's just a 60-Point-improvement, but it's so free that it would be waste to not go for that.

3.) Just a quick link to the glitchless version of the Green-Gem-Combo to show you that you can actually include the Door and the Piggybank in the Combo. With glitches it gets even easier, since you can just use the SJ prior to the Combo to break open the Cage, in which case you wouldn't have to do that mid-combo but would just break the Door, then the Pig and simply fall down.

Should gain a few more Points in the first room without too much effort, so I hope this helps

Edit: Also, relating to 3.), ignore the weird taking-a-Gem-through-the-wall-by-rolling thing, since with glitches you have the Mushroom available to keep the Combo going, so you don't have to rely on stupid stuff like that.

I shouldn't do calculations when I'm tired. It's actually only 1040 points extra, sorry

1.) Yeah, you're right, that's probably easier.

2.) Problem is, once you break the door that triggers the cutscene, after that you only have a very short amount of combo time left, despite having killed a Hoodblaster right before. I don't know why this happens, but that would probably prevent me from getting gems from behind the door

3.) Thank you very much!

Yo guys, just a quick heads up because unfortunately you won't be hearing too much from me in the next weeks because of exams and Christmas:

I'm going to finish the Combo Manager. Finish meaning adding full functionality to the Combo Database Feature (to make it actually useful and convenient, rather than it being a weird gimmick) because I thought maybe that's the best way to achieve our goal of a complete Video List: to just include that within the tool, that everybody who wants to get into scoring needs anyway. If I talk to Hunchman, we could possibly implement an automatic Update feature for both the Software and the Combos. We'd also be able to split up the work, so certain people only take care of certain levels, and once everybody is finished, we can merge everything into one "Ultimate Rayman 3 Database". It would also offer the possibility to create separate Walkthrough-esque files, that only contain the combos associated with a certain max score.

Because my problem over the next few (many? ) weeks will be that I'll probably be able to spend some time in front of the computer, but not necessarily playing video games. So programming and gathering data is the best thing I could do with my spare time right now. I'll try to finish this before the end of the year, but unfortunately I can't promise anything

But don't let yourself distract by my somewhat "personal" projects, if you guys would like to create a Video-List right now, we can do that anyway and then just copy all the stuff into the Manager once we're done. If that's the case, I'd volunteer to do FC, CF and BOM.

Also I'm back into the HoF because I felt like it. Possibly prevents me from getting bored of R3 too soon. So, fite me

What a coincidence, I just started playing with Glitches again (because I met the boundaries of glitchless playing for the most part), so I'm looking forward to some friendly competition

For my HoF-Score, I will try and see how many points I can get without IPGs, but down the line, I'm probably up for using them (even though that would probably be outside of an HoF-entry). I still don't like the concept of IPGs, but in the end, Glitches are Glitches and "unfair" either way. The conclusion I've come to is that ultimately, it comes down to either using no Glitches, or all of them. Friendly competition is what I need to really get me back into Rayman 3, and with you (and for that matter, people like sfn, DTUCC and MountainGoat, too - if they ever decide to get back into the game), I feel like not using IPGs just won't allow for that anymore in the long run. For now, I got BOM to 99.999 and I am currently on CF3 with 68.915 Points. I'll keep my Scores updated in the signature to give you an idea of how close I am to getting you, so you can go for counter-measures if need-to
Even though you should probably be safe from me for a while.

I probably won't spend much of my holidays "scoring" either. Appropriate to the season, I'm gonna have a look at SBTC again (I'm back to using Glitches in R3 alright, but there's no way in hell I ever want to play the stupid extended Green-Gem-Combo in SBTC3 again). As always, I'll keep you updated on any findings in any level I might make.

Edit: Speaking of IPGs, while playing CF today I remembered that it was never properly revealed how the IPG-Combo for CF1 goes. May I ask if the Gems in the hallway after the Vortex were included in your Combo? I've always wondered about that because I wasn't yet able to connect these Gems with one of the Hoodblasters in the first room...

Maz wrote:For my HoF-Score, I will try and see how many points I can get without IPGs, but down the line, I'm probably up for using them (even though that would probably be outside of an HoF-entry). I still don't like the concept of IPGs, but in the end, Glitches are Glitches and "unfair" either way. The conclusion I've come to is that ultimately, it comes down to either using no Glitches, or all of them. Friendly competition is what I need to really get me back into Rayman 3, and with you (and for that matter, people like sfn, DTUCC and MountainGoat, too - if they ever decide to get back into the game), I feel like not using IPGs just won't allow for that anymore in the long run. For now, I got BOM to 99.999 and I am currently on CF3 with 68.915 Points. I'll keep my Scores updated in the signature to give you an idea of how close I am to getting you, so you can go for counter-measures if need-to

The biggest issue with the IPG is TOTL2, if it wasn't for that, avoiding them would make much less of a difference. Most of their value is still of theoretical nature, especially in CF and LOTLD. But on the other hand, in my opinion TOTL2 is also the only part, where the IPG does not feel "cheap" because it actually flips the entire part upside down. In HH1 I quite like it as well, but it's too small of a part for the IPG to have a bigger impact on how the level feels.

Edit: Speaking of IPGs, while playing CF today I remembered that it was never properly revealed how the IPG-Combo for CF1 goes. May I ask if the Gems in the hallway after the Vortex were included in your Combo? I've always wondered about that because I wasn't yet able to connect these Gems with one of the Hoodblasters in the first room...

It actually has been revealed: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jzdW3HZN8O4
Brings me back to the notion that the IPG is somewhat cheap, because this is literally not different from the Non-IPG-version. We've put some effort into including the hallway-gems back in early 2014 but hadn't had much success unfortunately (it would make a big deal though if we found something with that). So you're only looking to take the entire 2nd half of CF1 with a powerup, combined with a pleasant 5-minute-flight towards that area

BTW, shoutout to DTUCC for having the nerves to actively look for an IPG and actually fucking finding one during a skype conference call

If I were you, I would maybe try the "go big or go home" way: if you intend to use the IPG in CF3 to aim for the super high scores, I'd highly recommend to go through the hassle and play CF1 with the IPG as well. But without the IPG in CF3, you might as well make CF1 less annoying for you, as you'll probably revisit CF at some point anyway.

HH could really "suffer" from the possibility, that a perfect Maximum Score might only be achievable through the IPG. That would on one hand dignify using that IPG (especially on PC), but I could imagine not everybody would enjoy if that happened.

In BOM and DOTK, we'll have to see if we can scratch together enough points to make it reasonable to replay these levels for higher maximum scores. If we can, PCM would also be somewhat mandatory. But these levels are currently so terrible, that PCM bothers me the least

Hey scorers!

A few months ago in BOM part 5, I had Razoff in the room closest to the green gem. I collected the lone yellow gem and sent him a charged shot, then as I was quickly running to the green gem, I was able to hit him two more times and I collected the green gem for 3000 points. Actually I don't remember if I hit him three extra times or two, and I haven't been able to duplicate it since then. But I could've sworn I got that green gem for 3000 points. I'll try it out again.

35 minutes later

Ok, so I was able to combo the green gem for 3000 points. Here's exactly what I did.

I sent Razoff a charged shot, then I immediately began charging another shot, while collecting the lone yellow gem near the red chair. I got close to Razoff as I shot him again. While he was running out of the room, I got lucky and shot him three more times, and collected the green gem in plenty of time to spare. I think it would still work for 3000 points if I just hit him two times, but I had a lot more time to get the green gem when the third shot hit him.

Ray502 wrote:I sent Razoff a charged shot, then I immediately began charging another shot, while collecting the lone yellow gem near the red chair. I got close to Razoff as I shot him again. While he was running out of the room, I got lucky and shot him three more times, and collected the green gem in plenty of time to spare. I think it would still work for 3000 points if I just hit him two times, but I had a lot more time to get the green gem when the third shot hit him.

Thanks for telling about this combo! Actually it's been discovered from Lance already (here's his post, if you're interested), but it's still cool that you succeeded in it; I mean, Lance probably just found it because he used slowdowns and savestates.
Also congratulations on your (quite?) new score, just 4k points more and you're in the top ten (again).


On another note, great to know that so many of you will try to improve your scores again.
I'll join in too. It's not too likely that I'll beat Cuts (let alone MandMs) score in the next time, but at least I'll try to get closer and also defend my current rank, especially since I know that Maz can improve his score extremely quickly, if he wants to and if he has the time.

I'll probably also list my scores, as you did, in the signature to make it easier for you to see how close our scores are. I just need to look them up in my game file...

Next weekend I'll start with improving one level. I aim for LS, since I should be able to get another ~1k points relatively easy. Probably I'll use the snapshot trick in the green gem combo in part 1, which actually makes me feel a bit like an unfair player, as in this case it'll be probably a piece of cake (except for the 10 shoe hits). But well, since it's legit...


Btw., the discussion in the stream reminded me of something I wanted to do a few years ago: I thought it'd be fun to try to find a strategy which would allow one to get a quite good score (maybe ~700k points or even 800k?) without any really hard combos and then make a complete video walkthrough of it. Besides the fun it'd possibly also help some players to improve their scores.
At some point I actually want to do something like that anyway, but depending on how much interest there is (if at all) it'd happen earlier or later. Also if any of you guys here also thinks it might be fun, we can gladly let it be a team project.
By now there's enough to do already, like the R3-Database or finally improving some scores, but I just thought to mention it anyway.

Cut wrote:But don't let yourself distract by my somewhat "personal" projects, if you guys would like to create a Video-List right now, we can do that anyway and then just copy all the stuff into the Manager once we're done. If that's the case, I'd volunteer to do FC, CF and BOM.

I can gladly make a video list of all levels and post it here. I mean it shouldn't make such a big difference whether I'll look through all the channels and pick out just videos of some levels, or videos of all levels right away.
There's just the problem that videos which once were private and now are public, can't be found that easily. Creating a list with such videos is something I'd entrust someone of you with.

Cut wrote:HH could really "suffer" from the possibility, that a perfect Maximum Score might only be achievable through the IPG.

As of now you're probably right. Without an IPG we know how to get ~31k in part 1 (on PC I think 30860 points). With an IPG we can get 41300 points, i.e. 10440 points more. However with the IPG you may lose only 9931 points if you go for the maximum, meaning the maximum on PC without the IPG is at most 119440 points by now; with an IPG it should be 119949 points.
Before I continue babbling like that, here's simply the updated points overview.

Well I'd certainly enjoy seeing that suggestion of high scores without really hard combos. Do you really think such a strategy could get to 700k?

Ah thanks Cut, I forgot about that video

PlumGMK wrote: Well I'd certainly enjoy seeing that suggestion of high scores without really hard combos. Do you really think such a strategy could get to 700k?

Certainly. I rushed through the game today on a different PC to get to SBTC for investigations, and I easily got 700k+ just playing each Part of each level once. Granted, I have a lot of practice, but there's definitely ways to get to 700k with mostly easy Combos. I actually had the same idea as 1234 about typing up/recording some "easier" walkthroughs since I feel like people who could try to get into Scoring might immediately be discouraged if they see these abominations we call Combos.

Oh yeah, speaking of "easy": Today, I got the Razoff single Glitch on my first try for the second time. Both times, I hit him with one curved shot and then immediately send another fist flying. Seems like it's a somewhat consistent way to get the single Glitch, which is probably useless for max Score, but I thought it might be interesting anyway. Who knows, maybe there's a way for us to abuse that somehow? Iirc, there should definitely be enough Points to get a maximum in the mansion one way or another.

Also, I wasted an hour today looking for places to do kickflips in SBTC3 - with no success. These holidays are gonna be sooo fun, I'm already fed up with this part...

1234 wrote: I'll join in too. It's not too likely that I'll beat Cuts (let alone MandMs) score in the next time, but at least I'll try to get closer and also defend my current rank, especially since I know that Maz can improve his score extremely quickly, if he wants to and if he has the time.

Good luck, I'll definitely try and chase you down

For now, I'm aiming for the following Scores: FC: 50.930, CF: 120.236, BOM: 99.999, LOTLD: 122.339, DOTK: 109.789, LS: 42.880, SBTC: 105.019, HH: 114.309, TOTL: 104.499, Total: 870.000 (non-IPG)

Edit: I also agree with what 1234 said about the videos. I'm all for finally having a clean database, but it's next to impossible to find certain videos because they were/are unlisted.

@PluMGMK: Yes, Maz is probably right, 700k should be possible with mainly very playable combos. The point is that just by taking the items in a beneficial order and, if possible, wearing most of the time a powerup-suit, you can accumulate already remarkably many points.
If on top you use some easier glitches, then I think you could be already somewhere in the 700k- or 800k-region. However, of course one has to be willing to restart some parts a few times (if necessary).

It may just be a problem deciding what combos might be included in the walkthrough and what not, but to give you an idea of it, I don't want to have anything like the matuvu combos in FC or so. Actually I'd like to include only combos which are at most similarly hard as e.g. the early first room combo in part 1 of LOTLD (from page 1), if at all, but I'll see.


@Maz: The trick for the Razoff glitch sounds interesting. I guess you send the second fist in a straight line, so that both fists will hit Razoff quite simultaneously?
Also, as you probably know, Razoff usually has to jump while you hit him, in order to make the glitch work. Does this still have to happen with your trick or can you somehow hit him at the same time, so that the glitch will still work when he's standing?
I actually don't know how we could use it to increase the maximum, but a consistent way for the single glitch is definitely something.

Btw., if you want to investigate certain parts of the game, you can also download the savegames from RaySaves. It's actually really useful for testing some combos etc..

Also, strange goal you've set yourself for CF..., reminds me a bit on your 109000 points in HH a few years ago.
Actually I also have to finally improve CF. Probably it'll follow after LS.

Trying to make it quick: I really like the idea of a video-walkthrough for beginning to intermediate players. If I happen to run into spare time on Wednesday evening, I can try that out (CF maybe?) and if It turns out to be good, I could upload it right away. I'd basically do a commented playthrough. Question is just what should I do? 109k after Master Kaag or 104k after the teensie highway?

Also while drowning DTUCC in Rayman-3-shittalk to violently force him back into the game, I did this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZfQGhB2eHw
Still very unhappy with this. As you see, I'm jumping around the weird stone-obstacle on my way to the mushroom, and that appears to be overall a faster route. If I happen to find more optimizations, we maybe could get the 1st Matuvu for 1500 combo points, but the Vortex has been a bitch. I've at least gotten close enough to believe that it's possible, but this combo is way too hard to justify failing it just because the Vortex ran out.

Cut wrote: Trying to make it quick: I really like the idea of a video-walkthrough for beginning to intermediate players. If I happen to run into spare time on Wednesday evening, I can try that out (CF maybe?) and if It turns out to be good, I could upload it right away. I'd basically do a commented playthrough. Question is just what should I do? 109k after Master Kaag or 104k after the teensie highway?

If you are aiming for a Score of ~700k or even less in total, I'd argue that it doesn't matter as long as you can just get 100k in CF. Personally, I'd say just do whatever as long as you somehow pass the 100k with relatively easy Combos. Fix "maximum" Scores like Master Kaag or the Teensie highway require careful planning, which is something one doesn't really have to bother with unless he wants to take the whole scoring aspect further, in which case you'd be more likely to turn to the advanced Combos anyway. At least that's my point of view on that Other than that, I'm definitely looking forward to how that turns out.

Concerning FC4: Didn't you already get the first Matuvu for 1.500 before? I could've sworn you got him after a Gem on the netting and then were able to zoom in on the second Matuvu after the Tribelle (which saves time because you don't have to jump up the wall with the 4 Yellow Gems) before the Vortex ran out. I mean, kudos to you for finding another way that works, but losing 500 Points for the Matuvu just to get more Yellow Gems with the Vortex is probably not the way to go

Concerning FC4: Didn't you already get the first Matuvu for 1.500 before? I could've sworn you got him after a Gem on the netting and then were able to zoom in on the second Matuvu after the Tribelle (which saves time because you don't have to jump up the wall with the 4 Yellow Gems) before the Vortex ran out. I mean, kudos to you for finding another way that works, but losing 500 Points for the Matuvu just to get more Yellow Gems with the Vortex is probably not the way to go

Remember that you take the 2nd Matuvu for 2000 points if you zoom on it right after the Tribelle, so you actually don't give up 500 points if you continue with the old fashioned way after that. It basically gives you a choice about if you find catching the Tribelle more difficult or getting the 2nd Matuvu. Because one of these two can be avoided with either method. So it might help other people attemtping this

And as said, I still have confidence to get both Matuvus for max value. The video just randomly appeared to me when I tried the new route.

Whoops, completely missed 1234's post in-between, sorry

Indeed, I was sending the curved shot first, then a straight fist immediately after. Tbh, I didn't pay attention to whether he was jumping or not, all I can tell you is that I got the Glitch first try 2 times in a row. Considering how much time you have to spend on getting the timing right on Razoff's jump to get the double Glitch, it would be a weird coincidence if I just randomly got it right twice in a row.

As for how we could use that, well - assuming it consistently allows for the single Glitch to happen because both fists hit Razoff at approximately the same time, then it should be possible to already hit him twice when he starts jumping (the curved shot would have slight delay), so maybe one can "consistently" get the triple Glitch when it would have been just the double Glitch otherwise?

There's also some other "fun" things I wanna try in the mansion. I'll let you know if my experiments turn out a success.

The goal for CF might seem a bit strange, I agree. The thing is that I didn't have a particular Non-IPG-Score planned, but I had Scores in mind for all the other levels. The milestone I wanted to reach for now was 870k, so I just calculated how much Points I had to get in CF by taking all the other Scores into consideration, and that's the one I wound up with

Cut wrote: Remember that you take the 2nd Matuvu for 2000 points if you zoom on it right after the Tribelle, so you actually don't give up 500 points if you continue with the old fashioned way after that.

Ahh right, I forgot about that. My bad, in that case, your new approach is obviously more proficient (albeit a lot harder by the looks of it).

Ahh right, I forgot about that. My bad, in that case, your new approach is obviously more proficient (albeit a lot harder by the looks of it).

Honestly, I for myself consider it to be completely free
Nah, but it looks much more complicated than it is. Once you've managed to do it, you're going to become consistent very quickly. My biggest issue is always getting the Tribelle on time, so having to think about the Matuvu as well in that situation completely kills me. So for me personally this new strat is very coming in handy.

If you are aiming for a Score of ~700k or even less in total, I'd argue that it doesn't matter as long as you can just get 100k in CF. Personally, I'd say just do whatever as long as you somehow pass the 100k with relatively easy Combos. Fix "maximum" Scores like Master Kaag or the Teensie highway require careful planning, which is something one doesn't really have to bother with unless he wants to take the whole scoring aspect further, in which case you'd be more likely to turn to the advanced Combos anyway. At least that's my point of view on that Other than that, I'm definitely looking forward to how that turns out.

Alright, sounds good for me. Hopefully I can do it without having to do any video editing

https://youtu.be/zYbQzoolpf8

This is my first attempt at the beginners-walkthrough. If you like the style of it, I'd continue with more parts tomorrow. Feel free to leave as much feedback and suggestions as possible!