Rayman 3 scores
- Thread starter Xenon
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He used to be a Mod you know!
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Well, you didn’t really answer the question. I’m aware you can start the combo at 99.999 + 1.500 points and reach a combo of 16.910 - 1.500 = 15.410 points. But 15.410 is not divisible by 20 either, so you manage to get rid of the Powersuit from IPG in the middle of the combo? How exactly do you do that?DTUCC said:Most of your assumptions are correct. when the combo begins, however, i do not have 99.999 points. neither do we have 99.999 points in CF and LOTLD when the combo begins, do we?
But a glitch of a certain magnitude, namely the IPG, has been found and that’s what all this is about. We will have to find out how to deal with it. We know your view on this. It is new to us while you have known for a long time. I wonder why you didn’t share it with us though since you use our HoF.DTUCC said:
I keep bringing up the MG glitch for one reason: It satisfies your requirements for being accepted into the HoF. It is pre-existent in the game and from reading all your arguments, it should be allowed. Therefore I’m very interested in why you ignore this glitch and not the IPG. I don’t buy the skill argument, it’s arbitrary. I will claim getting the biggest combo in each level is pretty hard and it requires skills.DTUCC said:
MandM81 said:
to put it bluntly, since MG's discovery and the fact that R3 HD has access to the HoF codes we will NEVER be able to 100% tell if a score has been reached under generally accepted terms. keeping an ipg secret now that the method has been revealed isn't such a big deal imo, though - ipg will just be another thing to consider whenever someone reaches a new top score.
MandM81 said:
Do you have a list of the locations where this glitch can be triggered?DTUCC said:
It does for most players, perhaps not top 10 players, but for 99 % of all players it will present a huge challenge.DTUCC said:
I’ll get back to you when we have more information about the consequences of the glitch.DTUCC said:
Maybe I’m slow, but how again do you land on a combo of 15.410 points when you have activated the IPG?DTUCC said:
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I believe CC will address the other aspects of your posts, soon, since they were answer to arguments he brought up. But I would like to bring up one aspect.
You have repeatedly referred to the HoF as "our HoF", essentially including yourself, but excluding CC, MG, Cut and me. What gives you more right to the HoF than we have? Why do you and certain others that you try to subsume under "our" have more of a claim to the HoF than we do? CC has been registered here longer than both of us. MG has more posts than you and I have only 100 less. We all have been about equally active in the R3 scoring community. Yet, you seem to believe that you have the right to grant and deny us access to the HoF. This is as much MG's HoF and CC's HoF and Cut's HoF and Xenon's HoF and Sajiki's HoF and Danone's HoF and my HoF and any other player's HoF as it is your HoF. If we anything, we should be grateful that RPC-administrators (Hunch in particular) put in a lot of work and had the necessary contacts to provide a HoF for all the Rayman 3-players out there.
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MandM81 said:
you can end on other elements than green gems, for example yellow or red gems, wooden doors or piggy banks, which add 10 or 30 points to your total, respectively.
MandM81 said:
thus, in my previous post, i did say i appreciate that you indeed seem to be taking a look at the glitch in your free time, which is going to give you a better understanding of the glitch in the future.
MandM81 said:
being able to get 99.999 in each level without any effort, thus resulting in a total score of at least 899.991 is not what i consider skill at all. using the biggest combo in each level to get past 100k does require skill indeed, whereas the previous 99.999 do not require any skill at all. this is pretty different from the ipg, since every point you make still results from playing a combo perfectly.
Big Quote said:
that is an impact the ipg has on playing the game - looking for levels that have cutscenes and consider if there might be an ipg involved in reaching a new top score.
MandM81 said:
of course I don't, but we don't have a full list of the locations where lums glitches can be triggered either X_X same goes for launching glitches. it's pretty obvious we have not found all of them to this date. the most recent example is your launching glitch in the doctor's office in DOTK. the launching glitch was just one of many factors you can't ignore when trying to set a new max.
MandM81 said:
again, MG's discovery requires you to play *one* combo per level perfectly. the ipg still requires you to play every combo perfectly in TOTL.
MandM81 said:
I'll be looking forward to it. If you have any further questions, feel free to ask.
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Excellent, so you've conceded that RPC should have a voice when it comes to future glitches. I'm glad that we agree that game-changing glitches are not bound by arbitrary rules like pre-existence and programming definitions.Sajiki said:
As I've said before, it's not about the scale of the glitch, it's about the nature. If the glitch in part 1 TSBTC with the infinite Lockjaw yielded a thousand points I would still consider it objectionable.Sajiki said:
@ DTUCC: Thanks for the detailed response. At least we're on the same page now.
I still find that I can't agree with you, but there's not much anyone can do about that. I would tend to judge glitches on how 'possible' you can conceive them in a gaming world. It is extremely difficult to explain but somehow rolling off a piggy bank and gaining lift from it makes sense, while exiting and re-entering levels like a ghost and obtaining infinite powerups, doesn't.
Ultimately it's down to gaming preferences, and while I understand your position, I can't bring myself to your level of acceptance. The IPG is an excellent discovery and if we do decide to use it I will not be upset, but it will never get my blessing. I suppose there are others here who share my sentiments. The best solution is to agree to disagree and be civil about it.
The main issue is how we deal with things like this that crop up, which describes my key involvement in the debate. A public vote seems like a sensible idea. What are your views on this?
New rules for the HOF also seems like a reasonable idea. I await MandM's suggestions... perhaps entry validation?
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- And on a side note I'm currently trying to improve my score on TSBTC. And ANOTHER side-note, is it just me who really hates the wintery music on this level?
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@Xenon: The great thing about the HoF is that it's public, free and, most importantly, you just have to enter the code that the game gives you. Entry validation would defeat all that because all, of a sudden, you couldn't just enter your code, it isn't free anymore. Validation would mean that there is some type of committee that determines who is actually allowed to enter their scores. As I've written before, the HoF is (and should be) for all R3 players, everyone has equal rights to it and validation would undermine that. Essentially, a HoF with validation is no different than posting a list of all players and scores in the first post of this thread. It goes against everything that the current HoF stands for: freedom, fairness and convenience.
I had been thinking about a public vote but I just don't think it is a reliable measure in this specific case. Based on the responses so far, we wouldn't expect a landslide, but rather, a narrow vote, that could be decided by every single vote. Now, there is the possibility that someone who is very invested in this issue asks a friend or maybe even several friends to vote, even though they haven't followed this discussion at all and have no idea what it's actually about. Would you be happy with a vote under such circumstances? Sure, we could limit who is actually allowed to vote but that would defeat the very purpose of a public vote and I cannot think of any objective and relevant and, thus, fair, criteria to decide who is actually allowed to vote.
I have no problems with your feelings about the IPG, I can even understand them to some degree. My main problem with all of this is that some people here are trying to enforce rules on how this game should be played based on their personal feelings. This is the “narrowmindedness” (to quote myself here) I have been speaking about. The split HoF-idea is the consequence of that and everyone who has advocated it, is guilty of trying to enforce their personal feeling as general rules to some degree. I am beating a dead horse now, but I can't seem to get the following through to you, as it seems: None of you have delivered any objective and relevant criteria, that still stand under close scrutiny, for why the IPG should be banned or split. As long as nobody brings up such reasons, I will never agree to splitting the HoF in any way shape or form because it would completely destroy the integrity, fairness and objectivity of the HoF, of the competition and of the scoring system itself.
@rolesfamily: It's nice to see you improving your score amidst all this controversy.
Personally, I love the music in SBTC, especially the tracks in the snowboarding part. It's the level itself that I can't stand, though.
I had been thinking about a public vote but I just don't think it is a reliable measure in this specific case. Based on the responses so far, we wouldn't expect a landslide, but rather, a narrow vote, that could be decided by every single vote. Now, there is the possibility that someone who is very invested in this issue asks a friend or maybe even several friends to vote, even though they haven't followed this discussion at all and have no idea what it's actually about. Would you be happy with a vote under such circumstances? Sure, we could limit who is actually allowed to vote but that would defeat the very purpose of a public vote and I cannot think of any objective and relevant and, thus, fair, criteria to decide who is actually allowed to vote.
I have no problems with your feelings about the IPG, I can even understand them to some degree. My main problem with all of this is that some people here are trying to enforce rules on how this game should be played based on their personal feelings. This is the “narrowmindedness” (to quote myself here) I have been speaking about. The split HoF-idea is the consequence of that and everyone who has advocated it, is guilty of trying to enforce their personal feeling as general rules to some degree. I am beating a dead horse now, but I can't seem to get the following through to you, as it seems: None of you have delivered any objective and relevant criteria, that still stand under close scrutiny, for why the IPG should be banned or split. As long as nobody brings up such reasons, I will never agree to splitting the HoF in any way shape or form because it would completely destroy the integrity, fairness and objectivity of the HoF, of the competition and of the scoring system itself.
@rolesfamily: It's nice to see you improving your score amidst all this controversy.
Personally, I love the music in SBTC, especially the tracks in the snowboarding part. It's the level itself that I can't stand, though.
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Let me be clear, I claim no right to the HoF. It was and is meant as a subtle reference to the "us and them" theme you have created on the German forum. As soon as you found the glitch, you password protected your forum, thus excluding any players in this forum from visiting your site and talk about the fascinating game that is R3. At the same time you (the German trio) entered this forum boasting new maximum scores and refused to answer any questions how they were anchieved. "It is a (German) forum project" was the answer we got. And yet, you enter your scores into "our" HoF without even notifying Hunchman or the HoF moderators about the controversial glitch. And now you have the audacity to dictate how the HoF should be managed? It is not "your" HoF to do with as you please and in my book you clearly have overstepped a line by not notifying the proper "authorities" in RPC.sfn42 said:
I think you know that. Why else turn up in this forum after a very long hiatus the very same day the glitch came to our attention? And to top it off, you seemed so much in a defensive mode you attacked both individual players and the RPC in general.
And before you apply to this post, if you chose to do so, I urge you to take a deep breath and have a lie down before writing.
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DTUCC said:
I'm all aware of that. I'm not sure if you're deliberately obfuscating or if I can't make myself clear. Obviously you use the IPG in your combo, but how can you get 10 of 30 points while wearing a Powersuit? You can't, so I ask again, how do you manage to get rid of the Powersuit in order to get these 10 points or 30 points into your combo?
If that is still unclear, please show a video of the last combo so we can see for ourselves.
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i believe i'm the one not able to make myself clear.
have 99.989 before taking the last element of the combo. let's say at this point, the combo is 16.800. all of it has been taken with a powersuit, as the ipg doesn't allow the removal of said powersuit. you take a yellow gem, the final object of the combo. your combo goes to 16.900, still divisible by 20. your score counter pre-combo shows 100.009, thus resulting in a total score of 116.909 without ever removing the powersuit.
i'm not going to be assuming you have any intentions when repeatedly asking the same question over and over, but it really shouldn't come as a surprise to you if anyone might get the suspicion that you're deliberately pretend not to understand just so i make a video of a combo you can very well find yourself. you know how many points the final combo is worth now. it's simple math at this point.
i hope this solves any misunderstanding about my score, because if it doesn't, I have no idea how else to respond, and i'm sorry about that :/
have 99.989 before taking the last element of the combo. let's say at this point, the combo is 16.800. all of it has been taken with a powersuit, as the ipg doesn't allow the removal of said powersuit. you take a yellow gem, the final object of the combo. your combo goes to 16.900, still divisible by 20. your score counter pre-combo shows 100.009, thus resulting in a total score of 116.909 without ever removing the powersuit.
i'm not going to be assuming you have any intentions when repeatedly asking the same question over and over, but it really shouldn't come as a surprise to you if anyone might get the suspicion that you're deliberately pretend not to understand just so i make a video of a combo you can very well find yourself. you know how many points the final combo is worth now. it's simple math at this point.
i hope this solves any misunderstanding about my score, because if it doesn't, I have no idea how else to respond, and i'm sorry about that :/
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I have argued that the HoF is free, public and for everyone, to equal rights. Yet, you say that there are some kind of "authorities" here, that should be "notified". This is exactly the point I am making, if the HoF is free, then there should be no such authorities, yet you keep assuming that there, thus creating some kind of HoF-hierarchy. I do not know why you keep doing that. I have never put myself in a higher position than anyone else with regards to that. I said that I have the same rights to it as every other Rayman 3 player and I will stand by that, even though you want to deny me these rights.
We considered and still consider the IPG an amazing discovery and not controversial in any way. I came back to discuss this amazing discovery with the people here (as I stated in my very first post since coming back) and I was honestly surprised by the controversy it created. CC has explained in much detail in September on why we didn't publish our reasons. I invite you to go back and re-read these posts. The reasons are still the same. We felt no duty to inform anyone of anything for two reasons: the equality of the HoF, as stated above, and the fact that none of us consider the IPG to be problematic in any way. We (and also Sajiki) have provided many objective reasons why we do not consider it problematic.
I do not know why you feel the need to herd authorities over me and try to marginalize my rights to the HoF.
We considered and still consider the IPG an amazing discovery and not controversial in any way. I came back to discuss this amazing discovery with the people here (as I stated in my very first post since coming back) and I was honestly surprised by the controversy it created. CC has explained in much detail in September on why we didn't publish our reasons. I invite you to go back and re-read these posts. The reasons are still the same. We felt no duty to inform anyone of anything for two reasons: the equality of the HoF, as stated above, and the fact that none of us consider the IPG to be problematic in any way. We (and also Sajiki) have provided many objective reasons why we do not consider it problematic.
I do not know why you feel the need to herd authorities over me and try to marginalize my rights to the HoF.
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please let's not get into an argument like this again. I think i made myself clear. I provided a calculation at this point, which should get this issue out of the way. I only felt offended when you began to assume I was "deliberately obfuscating" while I just tried to get my point across. That's all.
whether the phrase "please show a video" is asking for a video, requesting it, or just providing an idea to help me get my point across is maybe not for me to decide. i do however believe it's understandable that i misinterpreted it.
let's move on to more important concerns now
whether the phrase "please show a video" is asking for a video, requesting it, or just providing an idea to help me get my point across is maybe not for me to decide. i do however believe it's understandable that i misinterpreted it.
let's move on to more important concerns now